Hi All,
I have a Murcott hammergun with Damascus barrels (30"), a side opening lever and a walnut stock Serial number is 18511. I can't figure out how to attach photos yet. As far as I can see it has Birmingham proof marks for black powder from between 1875 and 1887.
I would really appreciate it if anyone here is able to give me any more information about this firearm?
Thanks in advance,
Tony

Photo link added afterwards Murcott Hammergun pictures

Theophilus Murcott of 68, Haymarket, London. He was bought out by Greeners in 1878. This gave them a London outlet. Murcott is most famous for his 1871 patent of the first really successful hammerless gun often referred to 'Murcott's Mousetrap' because of the sound of the action cocking. It is said Greener also wanted the firm to be able to make these hammerless guns but by that time the 1875 Anson Deeley boxlock had come along and the Greener 'Facile Princeps' shortly after. I have an unusual Murcott 20 bore that cock vaguely similar to the Facile Princeps and having shown it to Graham Greener he believes that might be the inspiration for their gun. He told me that Greeners never made a gun on the Murcott name although they made guns using the name Needham which is another maker they Acquired. Murcott guns are generally well made. No serial number lists remain.

I found this add for a 'Mousetrap' http://www.heritageguns.co.uk/Murcott%2016%20MT/Murcott%2016%20MT%20Details.htm This dealer is near me but I think the price a bit ambitious. I have chance of a 12 bore in good order for around £1,000. Here's another at an even more fantastic price! http://www.gunsinternational.com/guns-fo...un_id=100490220 A hammer gun again rather expensive. http://www.heritageguns.co.uk/Murcott%2012%20Hgun/Murcott%2012%20Hgun%20Details.htm

Just put Murcott in the search engine and you should come across quite a few. Lagopus.....

Here is what IGC has on Theo:

Name Theophilus W Murcott
Other Names Theophilus Murcott & Co
Address1 16 Essex Street, Strand
Address2 68 Haymarket
City/Town London
Country United Kingdom
Trade Gun maker
Dates 1854-1878

Notes

Theophilus Murcott was born in 1816 in Highgate, Birmingham. There were several Murcotts in the gun trade in Birmingham, but Theophilus and his parents do not appear to have been recorded living there. In the 1851 census Theophilus was recorded as an agent living at Bell Green, Lewisham in south London. He was living there with his wife, Mary (b.1815 in Stockland, Devon), their daughter, Elizabeth (b.1846 in London), and Theophilus' father-in-law, Ephraim, who was a retired farmer aged 71 born in Stockland, Devon. Almost certainly, Theophilus had been in London since 1846. At about this time Theophilus acted as agent for Tipping & Lawdon although they had their own London shop. In 1854 Theophilus established his own gunmaking business 16 Essex Street, Strand. By 1861 he was trading at 68 Haymarket as Theophilus Murcott & Co. On 15 August 1861 T Murcott and C Hanson registered patent No. 2042 for a hinged and rising / falling chamber block operated by an under-lever.

In 1866 he changed the name of the business back to Theophilus Murcott. On 15 April 1871 he patented the first successful hammerless gun which became known as "Murcott's Mousetrap" (Patent No. 1003). This was a lever cocking bar action sidelock with the Purdey bolt. Daw had invented a hammerless action in 1862, but it was not popular. Joseph Braddell of Wolverhampton and Joseph Brazier made the locks for the gun. In about 1871 Theophilus was recorded as a gun and action maker at 44 Brearley Street in Birmingham. It is not known when this workshop closed.

In 1878 the business was bought by W W Greener, but in the 1881 census Theophilus, aged 65, described himself as a gun maker (not retired). At the time, he was living at Gothic Cottage, Gold Hawk Road, Hammersmith, London with his wife, Mary.

Tim

Thanks for the info, much appreciated! I will try to get some better photos of the proof marks, would appreciate input on those also.

Thanks for the feedback, interesting stuff!

Wondering about the proof marks also. The 'wedge'fore end fastener makes me think the gun is certainly pre 1875 and even before the "Mousetrap" patent of 1871.
For sure its a classic piece, the way the sidelever curves around the hammer is superb.

I have added in a pic with the proof marks on the barrels (to the link in the first post). Apologies for slightly blurry photo. Any info again appreciated

Birmingham Black Powder Proof marks used from 1875 to 1887 and denoting some degree of choke in both barrels. Lagopus.....

no doubt about the marks - that puts my earlier theory in the bin.

True, pretty late usage of the wedge forend fastener. Gun could have been built over a span of years before going to proof. Lagopus.....

Lagopus, I greatly appreciate my stock being used to illustrate a posting but I would appreciate it if you constrained your comments to the quality, or otherwise, of the gun and its restoration rather than the price.
I have no doubt that you have access to some guns of fabulously good value but I would ask how much work has been put into their restoration, reproof etc and then their export, shipping and customs costs paid, to the USA for display and testing by any prospective purchaser.
I do not claim to sell cheap guns, however I am regularly assured by clients and colleagues that they represent excellent value in the US market place considering the work that has been put into them.
By the way, the two Mousetraps you mentioned are one and the same, the prices are near identical, one in £'s the other in $'s.
And lastly, although all distance is relative, since when has Derbyshire been close to Suffolk?

Toby, apologies and noted. When I threw up a few examples I found your example and just glanced at the web address which bears a remarkable similarity to a home dealer not far from me. The reason I thought the price a 'bit ambitious' is because I was recently offered a rather nice clean example in its original two tier case for £1,200. It now appears that I had seriously underestimated the potential value of these guns as a result. As you know they don't come to light all that often and so there is little to go on as to value. Agreed, shipping etc. can add a lot to the expenses incurred which have to be taken into account. That is probably why you are a successful and respected dealer and me a mere humble collector. I stand admonished. Lagopus.....

Lagopus, not a problem, probably got out of the wrong side of bed yesterday!
In all honesty, I am often shocked by the cost of some guns once everything has been factored in but what can one do...? Sell them at a loss?
The biggest problem facing restorers such as myself is finding potential stock at sensible prices. The 'retail' nature of the auctions prices has become a huge problem for the trade nowadays.
All the best.

Nice, refreshingly nice, dialogue

Berrien

+1 - There are a few individuals on this and other forums who could do with lessons in decent behaviour, but as stated - this is as things should be and a lesson to all - a 'point' made politely, an apology offered - and a polite acceptance.

As you say - nice to see and read.

Thank you Lagopus & Toby

What a pleasure to read an exchange free of contention. Your intelligent and civilized exchange is an example to us all.

Made me proud to be British which, lets face it, does not happen too often.

Doug Tate