I would be curious to hear about your experiences there. I've pondered a high volume dove shoot for years and I'm closer to making a decision but would appreciate hearing perspectives from those who have been there. What would you do differently next time, etc? What's the most cost effective way to get the most shooting in...getting a special rate with a group, going a certain time of year, etc?

I'm considering JJ's operation but I'm open to ideas, PMs, etc.

I'm also curious about any tips on traveling there. It's one of those trips where the flight costs as much as the 3-4 day hunt. I would prefer to book a double hunt back to back if I could travel more cheaply to get there.

As to guns, I would either rent one of their 20 gauge semi-autos or preferably take my 28 gauge.

It's been 4 years since I have been, but I went for two years in a row prior to that.
The two times I went we shot Doves only. The 3rd trip we had planned on Doves for 3 days then 2 days of duck and Perdiz, unfortunately I didn't make the trip. I decided to get checked out health wise and ended up doing a 5 bypass heart surgery instead.

JJ Caseria was the outfitter we booked. No complaints. Service and meals were great, bird boys were courteous and the shooting was fantastic. The lodge was clean and had everything needed. We hunted the afternoon we arrived then two full days and a morning hunt on day we departed with 6000 shells (best I remember) for $2700. Ended up shooting more shells than that. I don't worry about the shell count as imo after going that far I'm not worrying about shooting more. That was my reason for going.

Carried my own gun a K20 with 28ga barrels. No hassle.

I'm sure there are lodges that provide more,luxurious accommodations and entertainment but after shooting that much I want a shower, meal and a bed. First trip there was only two of us with another party of two already there. Second time we had eight in our group. Entertainment in the form of local band with cultural dancers was provided. I can not,comment on that as I went to bed.

More birds than you can ever shoot. Believe me I tried. 1000-1500 a day is about all I could stand.

Anyone that enjoys shooting Doves should definitely have a high volume trip on their list.

Good luck and have fun.

Bryan,

I've been twice, and we have an entire lodge booked for the first week of August this year. I've only done dove. I'd like to try a combo trip, and that may happen some day, but for now I am more than happy to concentrate on doves.

You should still have my number. If you don't, p.m. me and I'll give it to you. There is so much to discuss for your first trip that it would be much more beneficial to talk, if possible. For now, suffice it to say that it is a wonderful trip, if all the "i"s are dotted and the "t"s crossed.

All my best, SRH

If you fancy additional input, send me a kommuniqué & I'll put you in touch w/ a couple of outfitters who will field all your questions. Then you can decide what country, what area suits your fancy. Personally, I tire of shooting solely doves & like a mixed bag like adding Perdez, Ducks or both. Ah, but don't forget pigeons too. But as noted above the time of the year is important.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

I can add another suggestion; Santa Cruz Bolivia.

I have been to Las Palomas Lodge (Google Bolivian Adventures) three times. (Argentina twice)

Easy travel via 6.5 hr flight from Miami with no change of planes.

Easy arrival through Bolivian Customs ( guns cleared in 10 min )

Four days of shooting both pigeons and dove.

Lodge facilities, food and service were wonderful.

FWIW I'm going back in April.

I have hunted 6 time with Luis Seria, each hunt has been great. My last trip, 3 days dove and 3 day duck had a total cost of roughly 7000 including air and shells. Doing just dove should cost about 3000. Luis provides the first 1000 shells as part of his program and has several lodges around the country. I carried my own gun but today they have made it expensive and a real hassel in the airports in Chile and Argentina. The rent a 390 looks better all the time. Seria refuses to hook up with some of the big outfits because he says all they do is add 30%!?His web site provide better info. I think it is Seria Safaries.com

bill

Thanks for all the replies so far. Stan, I will call you.

I see Bolivian Adventures online but they didn't show any pricing?

I don't see Luis Seria's operation in a search yet. Are you saying that 3 days of dove hunting would run $3000? That's pretty high.

I'm definitely open to other locations but know that Argentina is tops for volume.

It's siersafaris.com.

SRH

Argentina is great! Go! Some thoughts -

- I much prefer the mixed bag hunts. The rub is that Cordoba (which most associate with high-volume dove) does not generally offer duck hunting. While I have shot high-volume dove in Cordoba and it was great, I was more than happy with the volume of dove at other locations (500 shells in an afternoon) that also offered perdiz, pigeon, and ducks.

- In terms of pricing, count on ~ $1000/day. Dove hunts can appear cheaper, but if you shoot a lot, your ammo bill will more than make up for the savings compared to a duck hunt for example. Ammo is typically $10-$15/box. I'm not sure any of the outfitters are inherently much cheaper than others. "Tipping" will also add to the bill and is often not highlighted in the advertisements.

- Guns: Every trip before the last one, I traveled with multiple guns. This last one I rented guns from the estancia. I could go either way in the future, but would lean toward renting. If you are comfortable with the fit of Beretta/Benelli O/Us and autos, I'd save myself the hassle and rent. If you are hunting ducks, you will already have a lot of gear with you. Slogging through customs with an extra gun case or two can be a real pain. Many of the estancias offer a range of rental options including sub gauges.

Happy to talk more offline.

Ken

Thanks Stan. That domain has been sold and isn't active right now.

Ken, good points on pricing mixed bag vs pure dove. The shells have to be factored in. I know I would like to do a high-volume dove trip but it is appealing to consider a large bag of ducks. A large part of the appeal to me on a dove trip is working on so many shot angles/presentations and getting to do it hundreds/thousands of times on live targets.

Kind of a funny way of looking at it but it is roughly 50 cents a shell in Argentina to shoot and here we pay about 40 cents a target and 20 to 25 cents for a shell which is around 60-65 cents a clay target. I am not counting the cost of getting there and being there of course but once you are there......

I hear you...that's an interesting way to look at the costs in comparing a clay presentation vs. a live bird presentation. Plus the different scenery, food, travel, etc. that adds up to more value.

Cost per shot is not a major consideration for most of our shooting but the volume does call for a little planning. The way I figured and justified my trip was that I was able to give myself and my son ten years of shooting experience in a few days. Plus you can not take it with you.

I agree that cost per shot in a high volume dove hunt is a non issue and that the total cost including airfare is one the the best deals going. Compared to a 3 day hunt including lodging and meals at a fancy put out quail lodge and its easy for me to decide which I would rather do.

I believe it is better practice for hunting back in the U.S. Than any of the clay games going. Plus a lot more fun. And I love shooting sporting, but I'll take Doves any day.

My experience with SA dove shooting is pretty dated. I began shooting in Argentina and Uruguay in 1988 or 1989 and went every Spring up through 2001. All of my trips were done through the Florida travel agent Trek Safaris. Uruguay is a little less expensive than Argentina.
<https://treksafaris.com>

The advice provided by others above conforms to my own. By all means make your first trip a mixed bag deal, including dove, pigeon, perdiz, and ducks. The dove shooting is just too much of a good thing and the shell expense is substantial unless you limit your shooting. One thing for sure is that after a SA dove trip, you won't miss a dove at home for a couple of years when the muscle groove wears off.

Have fun!...Geo

I always figure double the price for shells. Plus 20% tip. It's been over 25 years since I have been. I think the entire trip was just under 5k. It was almost a even split of the service to shells.
The bird boys got a penny a bird. Food and wine and lodge was outstanding. I know we used a local Argentina Rancher That was an outfitter for Dove/duck shooting which is no longer in service Ponchos' Argentina Safaris. Been thinking of going again it's unbelievable shooting. And yes you'll have a bruised shoulder and cheek.

Since the topic was Argentina, I didn't mention Bolivia, but I 2nd the option of Santa Cruz, Bolivia . They even have their own brewery between the 2 lodges.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

The topic was Argentina but any high-volume dove shoot info is welcome.

I was recently at Sierra Verde Lodge in Cordoba this past August. Everything was first class at the lodge and in the field. The food was fantastic. We took nothing but a couple of changes of clothes. You can shoot their Beretta Silver Pigeons or Benelli Montefeltros for $50 per day. I wasn't trying to set any records so I limited myself to 500 shells in the mornings and 750 in the afternoons. You can google information and images about that lodge. The outfitter was Trek Safaris here in Florida.

I would recommend a booking agent to help you sort through the paperwork involved now with taking guns to Argentina. We I first started going (1995 or so) it was simple in and out procedure at the Cordoba airport. It has become more complicated.

Now one has to visit an Argentine consulate in USA to register your guns and also the officials in Santiago, Chili want to look at all the guns even though the guns are in a transit baggage situation.

Some of this may have changed but again ask your agent.

I've shot probably 8 times there mostly with Miles & Miles and once with Los Chanares, both operate in the Cordoba area. Drives to the field are very short with Los Chanares 15 minutes max and 20 to 45 minutes with M&M. Both outfits have very nice lodges. M&Ms rent guns were not very good but that didn't affect me. I think they have improved their rentals.

We have always taken the time and additional expense of arranging a trip for one day to shoot pigeons, lots of fun and I would highly recommend doing that.

Also, the 28 gauge is the proper gun for doves and it will also hammer pigeons with no problem. You'll still need a pad on the 28 and/or a strap on pad depending on how much you want to shoot.

Its a fun trip, but if I were to go again I would consider Bolivia and Uruguay because of gun import rules in Argentina.

If going to Argentina I would take an extra day going down and spend the first night in BA for dinner and recovery at the Avelar Palace and then travel to the shooting area the next day.

Hope all this helps.

Bryan, talk to Russ Gould at Doublegunhq.com. He is in May, Texas and might be able to help. He has trips to Argentina and many other places.

There are many little things that vary from outfitter to outfitter, that aren't little when you are there, that are so important to the overall success and enjoyment of a trip to Cordoba. Things like how far you are staying from the actual shooting locations. You do not have to ride over 5-10 minutes each way ever, if you go with the right one. Some even put you up in a hotel and then transport you up to two hours each way to and from shooting. Because of this, they keep you in the field through lunch and cook for you there. Luis brings you back to the lodge for lunch, where you are met with hors d'oeuvres and a staff waiting to help you in any way they can. You have lunch, and can catch a quick nap in your room, if you'd like, before going back to the field for another three hour shoot in the afternoon. When you return in the late afternoon, same routine ...........hor d'oeuvres, drinks if you'd like, t.v., etc. He has a computer for you to use in the lodge. If you want it, there is a masseuse there in the late afternoons to ease the muscle aches from a long days' shooting. One of the evenings, immediately following the meal, there is entertainment in the form of a young Argentine couple who dance the tango, to traditional music.

But, maybe the biggest "little" thing of all, IMO, is the lady ( in the case of Luis Sier's operation) who is standing there at the Cordoba airport when you get off the plane, to walk you through every minute detail and step of getting through customs and the Policia, who go over your guns with a fine tooth comb. Do what Gloria says, and it's a breeze, each way. They know her, and know she has her ducks in a row. I'd hate to try it without an on-site person to help out there. It could be done, but the Policia know she keeps things straight, to their great pleasure, and there's never a hitch.

It may or may not make any difference in operation, but Luis owns all the land we have ever shot on. He doesn't farm it himself, but leases it to farmers in the area. He owns the 1600 acre roost, which is directly across the road from the La Paloma Lodge, and only about a mile from the bigger Riverside Lodge. Both compounds are fenced with a high security fence that is electrified at night, and have armed guards all night at the only gate. We asked him if this was necessary. He replied, "Never have had problem ............never will have problem. Clients too important to me".

Group rates can be negotiated, and we always do that. One person who is accustomed to international travel (if possible) should act as contact man for the entire group. Use a travel agent for the ticketing, etc. It is so nice to have a big group of your friends and acquaintances with you.The fellowship and camaraderie just adds another dimension to the hunt.

I much prefer early August there. Weather is crisp and brisk at night, and warms up to shirt-sleeve temps during the day. That would not be a deal breaker for me though, as I am sure there are other times of the year that would be great. But, in August, the crops there are all harvested and the fields are open, with crop residue. Beautiful farmland, beautiful warm gracious people. Everything one could ask for in the way of amenities.

I have heard of the death of one of the hunters at another outfitter's operation, due to an accident of some type involving a vehicle. So, there is another consideration, of which I will avail myself every time I go. There is a service called AirEvac, that will provide you with jet transportation from the site of an accident, or illness, to your choice of hospital in the USA............bed to bed. It is a short-term insurance that you purchase for the length of your trip only. It costs somewhere around $260, according to their representative which whom I spoke this week, for about 7-10 days. She told me of a hunter who was out of country recently, broke his leg badly, and the local medical facility gave him a choice of amputation or screwing a steel rod to the outside of his leg with screws going into the leg bones. He arranged an emergency flight home via a medical transport company, and it cost $25,000. I wouldn't fly overseas without that insurance.

At this point, I wouldn't consider going to Cordoba to hunt with any other outfitter. And, we have the entire Riverside Lodge booked for the first week of August, this year.

http://www.airevacinternational.com

Best, SRH

Stan's suggestion of medical evacuation insurance is well worth adherence. I know of local examples of one having it and another not having it. A friend's son was in the New Guinea jungles on an eco tour. He is a hemophiliac. What he was doing in a jungle, heaven only knows. He was injured and developed a bleed. No trip insurance. It cost the family $50,000 to evacuate him home. They had to take a second mortgage on the home. Then there was dad's buddy Leo. He bitched and moaned about his wife paying $75 for trip insurance. He had cardiac problems on the trip, an Alaskan cruise. Was helicoptered to a town and then airlifted to a surgical center. Spent two weeks in a Canadian hospital and was flown home all of the above at the insurer's expense. Gil

Some outfitters offer within the package Global Rescue(typically a 7 day policy) & I recently was in a group that a fella had a heart attack, so this service is warranted. This fella had the means to be extracted by still it takes several hours from Florida in any craft. And it is a good idea to know if the outfitter is a pilot or has a pilot on staff that can be on an airstrip w/in say 1/2 hour.

https://www.globalrescue.com/

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

And on a sidenote, Bolivian Adventures does have an airstrip; one of the CEOs is a pilot & they have a pilot w/ a plane on call. And the wife of one of the CEOs is a Doctor. One negative on the whole lot is the 10 year visa one has to purchase due to some quid pro quo between the U.S. of A. & Bolivia, but the Canadians go & come as they please. It takes several painful hours to get the fella to copy your passport.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse

Great advice from everyone. I'm enjoying the dialogue.

I hadn't thought that much about pigeon, perdiz or ducks. I'm still toying around with that. I know I would love any of it or just focusing on doves for the first trip.

Medical evacuation insurance is always a good idea on trips like this. I got it when I went to Zimbabwe. Can you imagine the expense? Or worse yet, getting a blood transfusion in Zimbabwe? No thanks.

I know it must vary tremendously but do you find the shooting to be around large flocks that flare or is it more like lots of smaller groups/singles coming by? I think I would enjoy the smaller groups and lots of singles more than a large swarm that is very hard to focus on individual targets.

No large flocks. Singles and small groups but so continuous that it's hard to call any of them singles. Hard to describe so many in sight and in range all the time.

SRH

They will put you onto a spot to give you a lot of birds to shoot. If you have a favorite shot tell them. Like high incomes or left to right birds. After all shells are where the real money adds up. They don't care how many birds you kill they care about how many shells you use.

I spent one day shooting right to left birds at different ranges until I got so dialed in that few birds going that direction were safe out to fifty plus yards. Changed my choke tube after an hour to extend my range. Next day I changed to shooting only birds going the opposite direction. Lots of practice makes you very, very deadly with a shotgun. I got years of chances at birds in the period of three hours. Enjoy it and figure out how to use it to make you a more confident and competent shooter.

When you shoot doves here on a dove field you will be shooting every different presentation imaginable. When you shoot where I did in Cordoba, you see birds flying away from you and you see birds flying toward you, all morning or afternoon. But they are like that as far as the eye can see on either side. They're leaving the roost or coming back to it. Two directions ..........that's it. Sometimes it's just pass shooting, all incomers.

At many locations you can shoot incomers for awhile, going away for awhile, turn to your left and shoot right to left crossers, then turn to the other side and shoot left to right crossers. Any presentation can be shot from one spot ..........take your pick. My favorite is to shoot an incomer far, far out there, then shoot another incomer so quickly that it falls in front of you. Two dead birds in the air at one time is "mucha diversion".

SRH

That's the kind of shooting I would enjoy the most...being able to work on the same presentation for awhile and then switch it up.

Dr. Drew: In 1900 what was the "repeater" offering from Winchester?
Thanks

???????? Wrong thread, maybe?

Best, SRH

No problemo, we can answer that question. The Model 1893 was followed by improved version called Model 1897. According to what I read that was darling of market hunters of that period. Short-barrel versions are still being made in PRC for Cowboy Action Shooters aka SASS shooters.

https://treksafaris.com/

these guys are great to deal with and handle EVERYTHING. they have lots of different trips, can schedule guides for city tours, etc..

What I failed to mention was that D. Krieghoff has recently shot @ Jorge's facility(Bolivian Adventures) & Jorge has secured a purchase of some Krieghoff's, O/U in 20 bore I believe for rental. One amusing item was that D. Krieghoff stayed a stint @ Jorge's fishing camp and thought it to be too remote & too native?

lp,

Raimey
rse

It looks like Luis Sier is wanting us to reroute our trip from Cordoba to Mendoza, which I'm feeling really good about. Luis says the dove numbers are not up to snuff (my terminology) in Cordoba this year. I'm really okay with that, because in Mendoza there are opportunities for other species on the same trip, including pigeons, ducks, perdiz and red stag.

When your outfitter calls personally from Argentina to talk to you, about issues like this, you have a pretty good feeling he is busting his chops to help you plan the best trip possible. Luis has always bent over backwards to offer everything he could to us to make the trip better. It was terribly saddening to us all when we learned of the loss of his lovely wife, a few years ago. She was such a beautiful and gracious lady.

SRH

Stan, those stags running past a hide, hundreds at a time, might be more than we are ready for. Do they provide a loader for stag shooting?

Stan, that is impressive customer service. I wonder what not up to snuff means on dove numbers? That's the first time I have heard of a Cordoba operation shifting clients to another location.

8bore:

I've seen several tied to trees. They have a terrible attitude.


Cheers,

Raimey
rse

If they do, I'm hoping for shells bigger than #8s.

SRH

Heard a vicious rumour in the past day or so that a cat named Amaro near Cordoba downed some 4867 doves(tórtolas) in 1 day, shooting near 75% for the day. Haven't done the math but that's pretty stout even if you discount some of the fluff.

Cheers,

Raimey
rse