doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com German Drilling...gold inlaid

Fellas,

I was just offered a gorgeous German drilling..16x16x???. Heavy relief engraving, gold inlay on frame & bbl wedges, carved wood. The name/address on top rib in gold is : H.LEUE HOFBUCHSENMACHER, BERLIN. Have any of you drilling fans heard of H. Leue. If anyone is interested in seeing it I have pix. Thanks, Tom tjw@foxriversporting.com

Tom, That "???" has a lot of bearing on its utility. With the Berlin address, it is almost certainly a pre-war gun (there is likely a three number date code on the flats). That means the rifle is almost certainly metric. If an 8x57R, 9.3x72R, or 7x57R, then no problem, but the calibers can start to get fairly exotic from there. Does it have a scope or at least claw bases? Most of the "liberated" guns game back without scopes. The glass was usually kept in a leather carrier which was missed when the home was searched or was kept by the owner/family when the gun was turned in.

Joe,

Thanks for the reply. No scope or bases. Were these guns typically marked for the rifle caliber? It is marked 16 on the bbl flats, but I dont recall seeing a clue for the rifle. I'll look for three numbers.

I suspected it was pre-war...had that look. I failed to mention the horn buttplate & trigger guard as I guess those are typical. Set trigger. I believe the bbls were approx 26".

tjw

I looked again and there are 2 "16" in circles and 2 "16/1" below them on the flats.

The bottom of frame is engraved: SYSTEM HEYM 60215 D.R. PATENT all arranged in a football type shape.

Post some pictures if you can.Sounds like it will need a chamber cast and slug the barrel to determine caliber.
Here is a Buschsenmacher Shotgun

http://www.hillrodandgun.com/picture.php?id=12517

Buschenmacher is the German word for gunmaker, and a Hofbuschenmacher is a semi-official title indicating approval from the city, or Hof, in which the gunmaker worked. I wish I could add more about H.Leue himself, but all I know is that he was in business from around 1900 to 1925.

The rifle barrel should have either a x.x mm mark, like 7,8 mm, or a gauge mark like 172/28 or 108/49. There may also be a date code of three or four digits like 1120 which would indicate a proof date of November, 1920.

Post a description of the marks on the rifle barrel, or better yet a picture, and we'll see what we can make of 'em.

Thanks men, I'll work on getting good pix posted...might not be 'till tomorrow morning..or afternoon as I have wedding hoopla to attend to. (not mine). tjw

Heinrich Leue(1837-1897) was a relative, some sources give Heinrich Barella as his uncle, http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20allemande/artisan%20l%20m%20n/a%20leue%20heinrich%20gb.htm , of Heinrich Barella and that Leue was an apprentice of Barella. Can't wait to see the pics and it might just be an interesting calibre.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Here's some forced translation info on Leue and he did lose his eye either by disease or an accident. Littlegun may have gotten his info from here: http://translate.google.com/translate?hl...l%3Den%26sa%3DG . Can any of you Greener students comment?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Don’t get too caught up by the “HofBuchsenmacher” title as it was similar to the K&K Hoflieferanten or Kaiserliche & Koingliche Hoflieferanten or Maker/Supplier to the Imperial and Royal Court and was pretty much just a marketing tool. The makers were suppliers to the court but it could have been for the gamekeeper where the top cat hunts or some relative of the top cat or one of his servants. The title wasn't limited to supplying the King/Kaiser only. For each empire there were volumes which chronicled the suppliers to the court and some particulars. But take Heinrich(Max.??) Barella for instance. In the mid 1840s he worked in Magdeburg and more than likely became a master gunsmith at or just before this time. But the mid 1860s he was a supplier or top maker to the Prussian Royal Court. And in 1871 he was a gunsmith and/or supplier to the Royal Court in Berlin. All examples supplied were supposed to be of benchmark quality but not all were owned by the Emperor/ruler and weren’t fully embellished. The appointment as a supplier was greatly sought after and I think there was a yearly fee involved. So some time between the 1840s and 1870s he probably made the transition to Berlin where the money was. Barella is purported to have had clients such as the King of Italy and Romania as well as the Tsar of Russia. I can’t say it he lived into the 20th Century but I guess not and that his heirs and assigns continued on. The same is with Heinrich Leue, (1838-1897?), as his heirs and assigns continued the business using the Hof-Buchsenmacher as a marketing tool and by 1916, or the end of WWI, I don’t think the suppliers were supplying to too many Royal Courts. Also probably beating a dead horse, but by turn of the 20th Century they didn’t make the longarms they supplied as they contracted to the best craftsmen, some of which were in Suhl and surrounding areas.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse