doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Help Identify Italian SxS Hammer Shotgun

Need help identifying an old hammer shotgun.

The barrel is marked Bohler Stahl F.A. Gardonese Made in Italy. There is no makers name.

















Rgds.

Made in 1958, per the proofmarks. The "Fr." is likely Fratelli, which means brothers. Gardonese might be the name, or just indicating that the gun is from Gardone, the Italian gun-making region.

It was made by FABBRICA ARMI GARDONESE. That is why the maker's mark is F.A.G. They were registered with the proof house, but that is all I have. Bohler steel is considered very good. In Italy this gun would sell today for $200 to $300. From the sling swivels it does not appear to made for the American market. We had a strong military presence when this gun was proofed. Possibly brought back by a GI.

Pete

Eyes going bad, Pete. That is "FA" rather than "FR".

Maker was surely Emanuele Novali - Fabbrica Armi Gardonese/FAG.

Have not been able to find anything else on the maker.

JC

it would sell here for around a grand.

I lucked out. Most days mine are in the same shape. That is why all my rifles wear scopes these days

Pete

oberndorf,

Just so you will understand how to date Italian doubles, there is a roman numeral on the water table, XIV (14). You add that number to the year 1944, which was the year that Italy was liberated, and you get 1958, the year of manufacture.

I just learned this myself when I bought a very similar hammer gun from a fellow board member here. Mine is a San Georgio, made in 1971.

All my best, Stan

Pete

Thanks everyone for all the information.

The bores are in excellent condition and I am assuming that it is safe to shoot modern ammo (lead).

Need some help with chokes.

Left barrel markings (underside) - Kg 1,370 18,3 17,3
Right barrel markings - 20,3 70 18,3 17,4 E. Novoli

Rgds!

left barrel is .040" a tight full choke
right barrel is .035" also a tigh full choke these guns were made for fibre wads so genenarlly shoot pretty tight with modern shells I have an Armi G Gamba that looks very much the same as your gun I opened the chokes up on it to .010" and .020" it is now much nicer to use
the 1.370 kg mark is the barrel weight a requirement at the time of proof if the barrels are wieghed and they are less than the stamped the gun is deemed out of proof (so adjusting chokes and forcing cones in Europe would render a gun out of proof)
18.3 is the barrel diameter the other number is the choke constriction 70 is the chamber lentgh not sure what the 20.3 is
check out your other post I posted some pictures of my Gambe for comparison

I don't think there's any hard and fast rule that adjusting chokes and forcing cones would render your gun out of proof. Certainly does not do so in England.

To the best of my knowledge, the Italian proof houses never required nor stamped the barrel with the weight. The only proof house that I know of that has done this is Liege.

Yes, your gun is safe to shoot with modern loads. It was proofed in 1958 so it is not that old compared to some here.

Pete

20.3 looks like chamber diameter in milimeters

I was of the understanding that the barrel weight was there as a reference from the time of proof and if the weight was different metal had bee removed and therefore the barrels were out of proof (I agree the choke shouldn't make any difference but forcing cone could as they are at the pointy end so to speak regarding pressure)
with regard to England I thought if you had the forcing cones done your barrels were reproofed? or maybe it is an urban legend? I had my barrels forcing cones a while back and remember seeinmg in the advert that the barrels were proofed after the work (which would have been hard when the barrels were all that was supplied no action went with them) this was from a "large" shotgunning gunsmithing franchise that has a shop in Australia (big enough hint without naming:))
intersting thread this I'm not trying to disagree with anyone just saying what my understanding was quite happy to be proven wrong

Hello Kid,

It is my understanding that the object of having the forcing cones done is precisely
to reduce somewhat the pointy end regarding pressure.

I don't know about reproofing but it shouldn't hurt.

JC

As I understand it, there are only two modifications to barrels that will automatically render a gun out of proof in England: lengthening chambers, and bore diameter no longer within specifications. Even wall thickness, just by itself, won't do it--although the British gun trade recommends a minimum. But there have been posts here previously by people who have had guns pass proof, or known of guns that did, with minimum barrel wall thickness below .020.