1 year old, 37 lbs, training is coming along nicely. This one has big range and run, it will be interesting to see her in a grouse woods:



When you are 1 year old, you are allowed to point the robins on your walk in the park:



Might be the most stylish setter I've ever owned. Head and tail high while running, looks like a bolt of white lightning crossing the elephant grass.
We need more work on wild birds. The pheasants in the park move from house to house, hitting the feeders and are like house pets, not cagey at all.
Best,
Ted

Great looking dog Ted! Love the shape of her head. My last two Springers have been mostly white and I find them much easier to keep track of than my first dog who was mostly liver. Of course the first dog was a rocket and very head strong but that is another story. Enjoy her out in the woods this fall and be sure to take lots of pictures.

Beautiful dog, looks like a great future hunting partner.




.

Beautiful!

It looks like and sounds like she is going to really like her job.

Congratulations on getting a good one!

Very stylish looking pup Ted. Bet you can't wait for the fall.

The first season or two with a new pup, is, uh, interesting, usually. No matter how much training I do, they seem to have a lot to learn in season one.
This is a pleasant dog to be around. Bidable, not hard headed at all, but, really intense. Unlike a lot of guys, I teach my setters the command "sit" and it took a long time to get that through her head.
I muscle her up by having her pull me around on my late 1960s newspaper boy's bicycle (it has to weigh 70 lbs) and a least 3 miles running in the park, everyday. I've discovered that if a pheasant is in the 80 acre over grown pasture (it was a farm before being donated to the city, and turned into a park) she knows it before we get there, and will find it in short order. I don't always get a point, however. I expect that will improve after we get over the bird psychosis phase of her life.

Best,
Ted

Thanks Ted. I was wondering about that. The pup looks alert in that sit picture, like under a command. It'll be interesting as in good interesting.

She looks good Ted! All that exercise is probably good for you both.

Like I said, she PULLS me on the bike, Lloyd-I have her leash in one hand, and a death grip with the other on the bikes handlebars.

Unless being afraid of crashing counts as exercise, she gets way more than I do out of it.

The walks have a lot smaller fear component.

Best,
Ted

Nice looking pup Ted. She looks like a natural born hunter.

Ted,
What a gorgeous girl. I want a new 4 legged hunting buddy so bad I can hardly stand it.

I have never owned nor hunted with a "big range and run" dog. Is that a characteristic that you prefer? How does that play out in thick cover?

Great progress Ted. Now it's just a matter of counting the days until Fall..

Bill,
There are many opinions on range and run. I am no expert, but, I know what works for me, and has worked for me in the past.
Setters and English pointers, are air scenters-they locate the bird from the bird's scent in the air. ALL other dog breeds are ground scenters, and locate the bird's scent on the ground. Air scenters should be able to cover more ground, quicker, and at further range than other breeds. I believe they can and do find birds that ground scenters miss, too. But, my experience has been, if a setter does not have the natural ability to work off a good distance from you (range) at a good clip (run) that trait can't be developed in that dog. A dog that has the trait can and should be able to learn to moderate both range and run in heavier cover. Pointers and setters should not be "boot polishers", dogs that work at or near your feet.
I had a Gordon Setter who could work in closer in heavy grouse cover, and also burn a field and lock up on point on a pheasant 125 yards out. I had an English Setter that really couldn't. I also had experience with Irish Setters that had, or didn't have, the trait. That is not to say the dogs that lacked range and run didn't turn out to be OK bird dogs-they did. But, the big range and run dogs were just better.
My dogs are about 85% pet, and the rest is weekend warrior hunting dog. They usually lack a little polish (example, I don't break them to wing and shot, as I prefer them to be heading in the direction of the bird I just shot at, especially pheasants) and while I owned a superb grouse and pheasant dog at one time in my life (the Gordon) truth be told, good grouse dogs are hard to find, way harder to find then good pheasant dogs. My last English had roosters pretty well figured out, but, never really caught on with grouse.
As you might imagine, that is just the tip of a very big iceberg, and I bet fist fights have developed over differences in opinion on good and not-so-good dog work.
A very good book I can recommend on all aspects of the setter experience, is "The Field Gordon Setter-The Black and Tan Bombshell" by Suzanne and Norman Sorby. It is my bible on training and all other aspects of living with dogs, and transfers well to other hunting/pointing breeds. The airline lost your pooch on a flight? This book will tell you where and how to start looking.
It may be out of print, but, Mr. Sorby recently passed away, and I heard a rumor it might be printed again. It is well worth finding.
I've heard some bad-mouthing of the Sorby's over the years, always from people who weren't as successful with their dogs as he was with his. Mr. Sorby held an advanced degree in nuclear physics, and ran a particle accelerator at one point in his life, and walked away from it to work and breed his dogs.

He may have been the most intelligent man I've ever known.

Hope this helps.

Best,
Ted

I think what you're describing is covered by the term "A Big-Going Dog", a term I heard or read many years ago. I classify my Setter as the same thing. It's been a big difference for me, as I had Springers for more than 20 years, usually hunting a brace that worked like windshield-wipers right in front of me out to about 30 yards. It's been an adjustment, although a pleasant one. He's easy to track when out for Pheasants, but if I take him into the woods for Grouse, I think I'll use the beeper collar I've bought just in case. I just had him out with me when mushroom hunting, and he was out of sight quite a bit, but I could usually hear him working in the woods all around me.

On his daily runs at the Fairgrounds, he's become an expert on Robins.

Regards
Ken

Ted,
my Springers hunt the air. My old gal that passed three years ago had an amazing nose. It took me a while to figure out how she was working birds but by air was the answer. I first noticed it on cripples when she was very young but by her second season that is how she worked all her birds.I killed many a memorable bird over that dog while she had her head high picking up the scent on the wind. Never say never or all when it comes to guns or dogs. Best regards,
Steve

I find the differences in Pointing Styles in Setters to be intriguing. Some seem to point with their head high, others with the head and back straight with the nose pointing at the bird, (usually with one front leg lifted) and yet others that go into almost a crouch, with the legs bent. The crouch type sometimes depicted well on guns like the engraving on the Baker shotguns. Mine has a tendency to crouch, causing me to be on the lookout for a restorable Baker Grade B which shows the same type of point.

Regards
Ken

Steve,
I only know what I read about dogs like Springers, since, I don't own any. All dogs are capable of both kinds of scenting, from what I understand, but, not all dogs will learn both. I've seen a few Springers hunt, and remember they spent a lot more time with their noses in the ground then my dogs did. Please don't think I'm saying that is bad, I'm not, it's just what I've seen.
Setters were a recognizable breed 1000 years ago, and have had people breeding them for the purpose of finding birds from before that time until now. A dog like the Labrador retriever, descended not all that long ago from a breed of dog that was not having it's nose considered as it's most important virtue, the Newfoundland. My experiences in the field with individuals of both breeds, have left me startled at how much sharper a setters nose is. My dogs have literally been on point in a ditch, as a buddy's Lab has walked past, on the road.
Can a Lab be a great bird dog? You bet. Maybe the best. But, I've been on the setter route for a long time now, and enjoy their traits. The good nose is one.
There is a style of dog for everyone who likes dogs, and what suits me, might bring damnation from others.
Ken, I saw a quote once, "Give me a horse that will walk, and a dog that will run", probably from a setter or pointer field trialer who had just had a bad day, that describes range and run pretty well. It can be a pretty fast moving game. I don't do the horse part of it (I hate horses) but, I slog along behind a setter in a WMA about as well as anyone, I guess.
I also remember a statement from the late Mr. Sorby, in one of the conversations I had with him when I was being trained to hunt birds with the setter he sold me (No, that is not a typo-I learned so much from that dog). "You can't develop in a dog, what isn't there to begin with".
That phrase, given off the cuff to me, has stuck with me for a long time.
I'm nobody's expert on training dogs. But, I enjoy good dog work, and a good time spent afield in the company of dogs, good, and otherwise.
If I didn't own dogs, I might not bird hunt.

Best,
Ted

Enjoying the thread. I've only trained and hunted Labs and love the heads-high. I gave up on whistles and arm-waving retrieves in marshes a long time ago. From my experience, retrieves are quicker if dogs left to figure it out. We think we know where the cripples went---and we don't.

Ken,
How 'bout a picture of that rascal? Do you need the starting pistol back?

We are pretty much done with it.

Best,
Ted

Ted, my dog is last days; I didn't hunt last season. Without a dog and gun, I'm lost.

You've got a winner. Man makes the dog.

Ted,
No offense taken. Not all Springers are the same. My dogs are are out of some field trial stock that a gentleman from Kansas had been working on for many decades. Roy French had been winning field trials at least since the fifties maybe longer and my dog Maggie's Grandfather was a national field champion. Roy was still active in the field trial game to well over 100 years of age. If I was going to own a pointer it would be setter just like yours Ted. I really enjoy those dogs as well. Here is a picture of her at about 3 years old. A short morning in Montana and a full limit for myself and my hunting partner. I really miss that dog even though I have her Granddaughter now who is just sweetheart.

King,
We will see. First season, with a setter, in my world, has always had a fair amount of comedy, with whistles, bells, and screaming. It takes a season or two after that one to become a team.
Man doesn't make dog. Contact with wild birds, does. Man just provides the truck.

Best,
Ted

Ted,

I'll post one once my tablet recharges. No hurry on the pistol. Make sure you're done with it before you send it back.

King,

Now is the time to get another dog. Find one that needs a Home. I'm sure there's plenty out there. One of my best dogs was a cross of Brittany and Springer Spaniels. You should have no qualms about getting a mature dog, they've always worked out for me.

Since my Setter is seven, I'm on the lookout for another pointing dog that needs a home. Maybe even a Springer, then I'd be set up like the Brits, with one dog for pointing and another for retrieving. A one or two year old would be great, as far as training. I always overlapped my Springers that way, it worked out well.

Here's an anecdote.

My first Springer, Fred, who was 18 months old when I got him when I lived in LA, was from show stock. (they all were) I trained him in a lot near where I was living. No live birds, just scent and dummies. He was fine when I moved back to Iowa. He was a great dog, very biddable, and a reliable retriever who always was able to find a bird I knocked down. He was also very smart. Back in those days I was still playing Rugby, and I always took him to the matches. He stayed on the sidelines with no problems and was always friendly and well behaved. His speciality was finding someone with food. He'd then go over and sit a couple of feet away, never looking at the food, with his eyes kind'a half closed, seemingly ignoring the people. After a few moments he'd get a pet and a sample of the food, his well-behaved technique was irresistible to people. He was one smart dog.

I'd have to go with that! My contact with bird dogs began with my grandfather turning me loose on the farm with instructions to just follow the dog. That's pretty much still all I do...Geo

Steve,
This is Louie's maternal grandfather:

http://www.amesplantation.org/field-tria...-shadow-oak-bo/

I don't think Bo had a good day at the 2015 trials, but he has had a few in the past. Like I said, my dogs have to have great family interaction first, hunting comes second. My wife and son have a say in the dog.
All is not skittles and beer as I type-just heard from the vet that the dog may lose the last several inches of her tail, due to a re-injury of a crush wound to her tail. We have our fingers crossed, and she is on meds for the condition.

Best,
Ted

Ted,
sorry to hear about the tail injury. I hope she has a complete recovery. As you know Springers tails are docked. They try to leave a white "flag" on them and Maggie ended up with a pretty darn long tail for a ESS. I learned the hard way why they dock those tails on an early season trip to Montana. She ended up with a raw section on the end of her tail about 3" long from the thorns and heavy brush. Her tail did not heal the whole season and I made feeble attempts to bandage it for her but it was no use.

I agree, mine are house dogs first, hunters second. Great companions and friends.

looks like the Ames plantation does some great things with setters. Thanks for the link. Best regards,
Steve

Here's a couple of pics of my Big-Goin' Knucklehead.

"Fine Boned" is definitely NOT a term you'd use to describe him. At least he's easy to keep track of while he's gallumping around through heavy cover.

Ken,
He is built like my last female setter, Miss Gypsy:



She was well outside breed standard for a female, about 70 lbs, most of her life. She was a good, but, not great, pheasant dog, capable of finding and retrieving winged birds, and she would set, relocate, and pin running birds about as well as any dog I've ever known. That lazy looking point is actually a dog in tune with what a rooster is up to at that moment.

That is exactly what she did in this picture, near Marshall, MN. a few years back. After I took the picture, I dropped the camera in the snow, walked up, and shot the rooster, and spent the next 1/2 hour looking for my wife's camera.

It was all good.

Best,
Ted

All this Setter talk spurred me to find a buddy for my dog. One that needs a good home. I'm going to go get this one on Sunday.

He's a well-trained, Big Goin' Dog as well.

Now I'll be able to make my own Setter version of a "Black & White" Scotch ad...

http://images.craigslist.org/01313_5YTEItXMYCf_600x450.jpg

Good for the both of you Ken! That is a great looking dog, as is your current companion.
Steve

Thanks Steve.

Bill,

If you want him before I get too attached, let me know. It'd be kind'a a long trip for you to pick him up..

Here's a couple of Setters that need a good home, near Des Moines, IA. An English and a Gordon. A ready-made Brace. What fun!

http://desmoines.craigslist.org/for/5020877201.html