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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,173 Likes: 1159
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,173 Likes: 1159 |
Send me some photos, Francis, and thanks for the offer. (stanhillis@gmail.com) I am watching an auction today, too.
An old quail hunting friend of my Grandad's told me about once seeing Grandaddy shoot into a covey of birds on the ground with his '97, killing seven, then kill six more on the rise with the remaining six shells. 13 quail with 7 shells. These were the times of meat hunting on this farm, and shooting into a covey on the ground only saved shells.
SRH
Last edited by Stan; 09/25/16 02:09 PM.
May God bless America and those who defend her.
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,190 Likes: 15
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 1,190 Likes: 15 |
The increased firepower of the old Model '97 probably contributed as much as any gun design to the eventual demise of the double gun; as in turn of the century accounts of hunting prowess, I've read more than one account of a Model '97 shooter having seven dead ducks in the air simultaneously. I don't know any shooter that could do that with a side x side? These old time meat hunters were very good at their craft; and no wander pumps and semi-autos are required to be plugged to 3 shells.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
Only one problem I don't think they ever held seven shells....
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,173 Likes: 1159
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 13,173 Likes: 1159 |
Maybe I'm remembering it wrong, or maybe Mr. Starr remembered it wrong. That was many years ago. What is the capacity ............. 5 in the mag and 1 in the hole?
SRH
May God bless America and those who defend her.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
I don't think they ever held 7 shells....
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Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,381 Likes: 1
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 9,381 Likes: 1 |
I suspect it was used by market hunter of late 19th and early 20th century. It is remarkable design with many parts that lasted for long time while it's competitors like the Burgess or Spencer did not. I seem to remember capacity being same as Model 12 five plus 1. I'm always on lookout for long barreled open choke one. The last "shot & ball" special was 16ga with long barrel and IC choke. It was in bad shape so I did not buy it. One advantage of this gun is that Norconia (Norinco) is making new clones for Cowboy shooters. I suspect parts will interchange with little fitting. This is big plus for this model.
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 15,456 Likes: 86 |
I wouldn't take anything for my 97...it was made around 1954 I don't think the wood is original to the gun. I know the pads not because I put it on. The barrel is 30" full choked, It's a smoker on sporting clays. I duck hunted with it last year in Arkansas and shot 2&3/4" Bismuth. I've heard the old stories of people cutting their hands on the back of the bolt...but that can only happen if you're not paying attention to what you are doing. In my opinion it was one of John Brownings premier designs...the gun the model 12 always wanted to be.
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 8,158 Likes: 114
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 8,158 Likes: 114 |
Will do, and you are welcome, Stan. I have never seen either a Model 12 or a Model 97 with an extension magazine, as sometimes seen on both Browning A-5 and Remington M11's (pre-1934 3 shot plug law)- back in the market hunting days. My Model 97 will hold 6- five in the magazine tube and 1 in the chamber- the Model 12's hold one more shell - both sans the plug. By the way, Stan, my M1897 is a series E--last revision that I am aware of until the last ones were built in 1957. I keep a 3 shot plug in it, as the Fall turkey season here in MI runs from Sept. 15th to November 14th, and overlaps the waterfowl season. I don't need some over zealous "Raccoon Ranger" trying to give me a citation because 90% of the private lands I hunt for turkeys are also areas where I hunt ducks and geese. That's also why I haven't yet used the M97 with steel shot, as we can still use lead shot loads legally for turkey hunting. But I have 4 12 gauge Model 12's that I have been shooting steel shot loads in for 30 years or so, all have original factory full chokes, and there is absolutely no sign of any bulging of the barrels, whether at the muzzles or elsewhere. Can't beat the WRA nickel steel or Winchester Proof Steel barrels on the Model 12's or 97's either. Darn near indestructible.
"The field is the touchstone of the man"..
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Joined: May 2008
Posts: 8,158 Likes: 114
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 8,158 Likes: 114 |
Almost, oh Murph of Da Surf. pages 87 and 88 of my Winchester Catalog number 75 (actually, catalogue) March 1909- I counted 98, but what da hey, right? And the devil is in the details, right? Hope you fared well at the Vintagers blast this week-end. I was in Peru, Indiana after doves- Fox 20 bore- raised the profit margin for RST, that's for sure- lotsa air around those doves--
"The field is the touchstone of the man"..
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 39 Likes: 7
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 39 Likes: 7 |
I have two. One is a 30's gun, which prior to my purchasing it, had the barrel cut to 24" and a Briley choke tube installed. I use it for deer driving when I want to change up from the NID Mag 10. It patterns my stash of Hevishot OO very well. The prior owner used it for a turkey gun.
The other is a 50's made gun with 30" full choke barrel. Never have quite figured out why I bought it, other than I had wanted one ever since reading Nash Buckingham back when I was in high school. Never figured out a use for it. I have thought it might make a good late season dove gun or even for walk up snipe, but just have not gotten around to giving it a try. This just might be the year.
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