doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Late vintage Tobin?

Who's gun would that be, Roy? Dave (Researcher) already knew his was a Black Diamond, as did h d hawgr. The post by Valman noted engraving of a dog on a lockplate, and case colors, which pretty much rules it out as a Black Diamond #55, as the catalog says it is a mid-priced gun with line engraving, and a black finish.
Which gun are you talking about?
Best,
Ted

I had my wires crossed!Iam talking about researchers gun. Woodstock Tobin made the same model. For the record having seen the transaction records I can confirm that all Tobins machinery and tooling was transfered from Norwich to Woodstock hence the identical gun.

I suppose a Crandall built gun could be a mis-mash of previously available features, like engraving and a black finish with some case colored hardening thrown in for good measure.
I like Tobins, but, sometimes the market gets it perfect, and the better guns win. A Tobin isn't a Fox, or an LC Smith or a Parker. I truly believe that high pressure ammunition is and was the death of these old guns. Too many of them out there are off the face while looking about like Researcher's gun up there, pretty good for 100 years. The stock dimensions usually are short, with too much drop. The splinter forearm tends to be impossibly small. Tight bores, chambers and tight chokes have, for the most part, passed into history.
They can be MADE into a passable field gun, with an understanding of the limitations. They don't typically come that way.
And at that point, if you had started with a Fox, or a Parker, you might get some of the money back.
By the way, thanks for clearing that up, Roy.
Best,
Ted

Some of the very late Crandall guns don't even have the true Clarance Wollam action with the floating V-shaped mainspring powering the hammer and acting as the cocking rod. He fitted a coil mainspring and follower on the sideplate, getting closer to a sidelock.

The two Norwich catalogues I have seem to be 1906 and 1907 and don't have the Black Diamond Model in them, but the 1907 came with a flyer introducing the Black Diamond and it is stamped "Received Nov 7, 1908." It mentions that they would finish up other of their grades in the "Pyro-Oxidized" black finish as well. I tracked down one of Frank Major Tobin's grandsons and did an article on Frank's gun in The Double Gun Journal, Volume Eight, Issue 1. It was a top-of-the-line No. 60 Model Grade and had the Pyro-Oxidized black finish. It looked like the gun pictured in the Canadian catalogues as a Regal Grade No. 250.

When I visited Woodstock in September 1994, there was a discount shoe store in part of the old Tobin factory building.

I have three Crandall-era catalogues of his Tobin guns and none mention the Pyro-Oxidized black finish. Crandall's guns were graded A to E from lowest to highest. The E-Grade shown in the catalogues appears to have serial number 19391. By the latest catalogue he had dropped the cheaper A and B grades and added ann E-Special grade at the top end.

Thaks, Roy. This one has double triggers and extractors. The wood might be a bit better than standard, but not exceptional, and the buttplate looks like a generic partly grooved, gutta percha type of the period. I guess this and the serial number make it the ultimate factory-made parts gun.

If this works, I am showing a Norwich Tobin 16 I bought recently. This is a second attempt at photo posting, no real addition to this thread's content.

Terry, very nice Tobin! I'd like to see that gun. Maybe next time I'm moving projects down to Keith we could get together? Like half of the Norwich Tobins I've looked at, it doesn't match any of the pictures in the two catalogues I have. Are the barrels Trojan Nitro, Krupp or DeMoya?

Barrels are Krupp.

I would enjoy getting together either here or at Keith's.

Good lookin' Tobin, however.
Bet you have the only one on your block.
Best,
Ted

Terry/researcher, I owned Woodstock Tobin #16261. It was in similar condition to yours. The gun was purchased in 1916 by an M.D. practicing in Saskatchewan, I purchased the gun from his son a retired army officer. The gun was a 12.G. and was finished equivalent to the model 100 trap or duck gun, as seen in the Woodstock, Tobin catalogue. The barrels were 30 inch,Krupp steel.It had 3 inch chambers. One unusual feature was the use of recessed chokes, both barrels being full choke. The engraving was border style with a duck in flight on both lock plates.It was stocked in excellent french walnut.The action was tight on the face despite 70 years of service.
The highest grade Woodstock Tobin that I have seen was a model 200 12.G. with 2 sets of barrels 30&28 inch,auto ejectors and double triggers. serial # was 17899. This gun also had Krupp Barrels. A former employee of Crandall told me that the the high grade guns were sent to England to be engraved.I decided against purchasing this gun because the action had been over stressed and as a result was badly off the face.