doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Daly Damascus color?

Raimey, I had the "1930" Sloan catalog in my hands yesterday. A friend just received it from Pat. It includes the Model 37 Ithaca and other very late thirties items. My guess is that it is actually a 1937 to 1939 catalog.

Thanks eightbore for the contribution of effort to the cause. Do you recall any listing for German makers like Abesser(Paul) & Merkel(Ernst)? They appear to have been in business in the 1920s and early 1930s and had Sloan's listed as being "sole agents". One Abesser & Merkel drilling I've seen had ejectors on all tubes. Ernest Merkel attained the rank of master on August 14th, 1929. Speculation is that he was from the line of Friedrich Ernst Ferdinand Merkel. Paul Abesser must have been a master in order to found the firm.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

#22100?


A little too much flash

Although I don't think the Charles Daly Regent Diamond Drilling was made by Lindner, it is a pretty nice example at GA # 919324477 . Thanks to Mr. Hallquist for his every watchful eye. I think Gebrüder Adamy made it. Schüler might be next in line as a possible source. But the more I read the less likely I think Schüler was the actual manufacture post WWI. He may have been the wholesaler, but he would have procured, or fab-ed, the components and then subed the work out to craftsmen who performed specific tasks. Some of the craftsmen would have been involved from the get-to.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Here's some info from a 1927 "Forest & Stream" advert: Gebr. Adamy Over- Under Shot Gun, $165; Three Barrel Adamy, $148.50. Also have in stock Trap Gun and Field Gun with single triggers; bargains. Sloans Sporting Goods Co.."

Evidently everything was on-sale.


Current production Drilling; Vierlings are also an option.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Many may tire of this infinite thread, but hopefully one day we'll have most of the Daly/Lindner/Sauer story. It seems that J.P. Sauer changed "sole agents" quite often as in 1892 Wiebusch & Hilger, Limited of 84 & 86 Chambers Street, New York were "sole agents": http://books.google.com/books?id=AEM9AAA...uhl&f=false .

As usual in searching for something else, I stumbled across the following info but haven't found the full document. Albeit a bit of opinion, I think it gives insight to the overall picture of the Daly/Lindner/Sauer relationship and should have been quite accurate seeing it was penned in the mid 1940s. The gist being the following:

Charles Daly had an idea, and apparently an accurate one, of what the American sportsman would hold in esteem and cherish. He travelled to England to procure a concern to build his American idea of a sporting scattergun. None of the British concerns would give him the time of day with respect to his idea of a longarm for the sportsman of the U.S. of A. So for some reason, and I speculate it was August Schoverling, he turned to Germany where he found a relatively unknown craftsman by the name of Lindner(I assumed the name was used loosely referring to Georg and later H.A.). I think it is here that the retailer/wholesaler/component source/craftsman model needs to be addressed. Lindner was the wholesaler and served as quality control before the examples were shipped to Schoverling, Daly & Gales. Lindner sourced the components and had craftsman to perform specific tasks and I think they continued to continue the same after the death of Lindner's son in 1915 with another wholesaler at the helm possibly with Lindner having a partial role. Conjecture from the mid 1940s has it that Lindner finished the upper rung models while the run of the mill Dalys were more or less completed at the Sauer facility and inspected by Lindner. Where the cut-off was, I can't say for now, maybe the 275 or 375?

Charles Daly's son, along with Gales, continued the business and it appears that both expired by 1925. It was then in 1927 or 1928 that Schoverling, Daly & Gales was sold to Davega Sporing Goods, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davega_Stores (I know some of you don't cotton to Wikipedia), while the Daly trademark was sold to Sloan's Sporting Goods at about the same time.

Then it looks like Davega Sporting Goods faltered in the early 1960s(1963) and Modell Sporting Goods absorbed them. Maybe that's the Modell Sporting Goods connection.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

I've read several places including a Charles Daly site that in 1919(one source gave 1910 but may have been a typo) that Henry Modell purchased S,D&G but most give that the successor to S,D&D was I. & S.D. Davega, which was founded in either 1878 or 1879. And in 1927 or 1928 Sloan's Sporting Goods purchased the trademark/tradename Charles Daly so any longarm post say 1928 with Charles Daly on it would have passed thru Sloan's Sporting Good's books.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Re: Raimey's June 21 respone to my photo posting:
Paul Dever visited a week or so ago, and found some of the info requested marked on the barrels. Proof date is 8/25. "M Sch." is stamped on the lower barrel. Serial is 14912

Terry, thanks for the effort and to whomever the initials "M.Sch." belong, he was quite busy post WWI up until the mid 1930s. 15k examples over 10 years at first sounds a bit much for production during the difficult post WWI period, but I guess it is possible. For now I don't think Schüler made it but it is possible he could have been the wholesaler who sourced the components and sub-ed the work. S,D&G's name and business was diced up and sold during this period and I'd continue to look toward Sloan's Sporting Goods and Adamy for the sourcing & work.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Griffin & Howe has an interesting Otto Bock SxS offering that looks Linder-eske(?):
http://www.griffinhowe.com/sgmoreinfo.cfm (select "Used Shotguns" & go to the Os.



Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Ok, still sorting the chaff but it appears that in 1926 the Knickerbocker Talking Machine Company, owned/ran/governed by Abram Davega, son if I. Davega, absorbed Schovering, Daly & Gales and the result was Knickerbocker, Schoverling, Daly & Gales and a reprint is available at Cornell Publications:
http://www.cornellpubs.com/old-guns/item_desc.php?item_id=415 The venture must have been short lived.

Also wanted to cross reference the Joseph Jakob thread:
http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=235883&page=1

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse