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4 members (SKB, LGF, 2 invisible),
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Apr 29th, 2024
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,568 Likes: 100
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,568 Likes: 100 |
I shot a nice light A&F Francotte this morning. 20 gauge, 26", 2 3/4" chambers, SFE, POW stock, DT, wormholed buttplate. Engraved sideplates, sound wood, overall 90%+.   What the heck is it. - Year of manufacture? - Grade / Model? - Chokes? - Value?
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,050
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,050 |
Good Shooting
T.C.
The Green Isle
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,271 Likes: 202
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 6,271 Likes: 202 |
Looks like a Grade 25 Ejector.
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Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 5
Boxlock
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Boxlock
Joined: Sep 2012
Posts: 5 |
Well the best I could tell from the pictures is it looks to be Belgian post 1952. Both controllers listed on this gun held proofs in 1952. There looks to be a really faint date code on the gun. If it is the correct one it would make it a 1953 piece. Which would fall into the timeline of hoth the below listed controllers.
Controller of Proof - Daenen Charles 1952-1968
Controller of Proof - Laenen Clement 1952-1986
Best I could do with the pictures of the gun. Try to find pictures of what other guns similar to yours are selling for to get a value, if you can find any.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 173 Likes: 8
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 173 Likes: 8 |
Bob, The Francotte was built in 1961 since it has the Greek letter Phi as the date code there among the proof marks. It was received in inventory at Abercrombie & fitch in NYC on October 20, 1961. The model is a Grade No. 20E according to the A&F record book. The listed specifications seem to match those that you have described. The shotgun was sold at A&F for $675 later that same month. Compliments of Griffin & Howe, Inc. http://www.griffinhowe.com/research-main.cfm
Bob Beach
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,568 Likes: 100
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,568 Likes: 100 |
Thanks, you guys are great.
With the exception of a worm holed buttplate the gun seems a solid 90%. On consignment at my club and thought to be a Knockabout.
Choke markings? How about all the barrel markings?
Seems to carry a substantial premium for being a subgauge. Care to venture a guess as to value?
Thanks again,
Bob
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,380 Likes: 105
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,380 Likes: 105 |
Wouldn't have needed Bob Beach's precise info to know it's not a Knockabout. They weren't sideplated.
Current Blue Book says $3400 for a 90% 20E. Then add 100-150% premium for 20ga. From Francottes I've seen listed, that seems some steep, but not a lot. In the condition you describe, I think it'd be a buy at $5,000.
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Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,568 Likes: 100
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 1,568 Likes: 100 |
How about chokes?? 
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 12,743 |
Bob;
1mm =.039. The difference between 15.9 & 15.8 is 0.1mm or .0039 roghly 4 thosandths of an inch or an I/C choke. I don't off hand recall for certain that is the proper interpretation of those two marks for this time frame. At some point in time it seeems as if the Belgians stamped the bore dia when it came in for proisional proof & then re-stamped it at final proof. Finishing up & polishing the bores could account for this .1mm difference. Choke then would simply mean it is not a cyl bore but has some unstated amount of choke.
Miller/TN
I Didn't Say Everything I Said, Yogi Berra
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
The barrels weighed 1.083kgs or 2.38lbs at time of proof.
It passed Superior Proof 20,000 psi for gauges under 16ga.
As of 1924, the diameter of the choked portion is no longer indicated by the proof house.
Siemens Martin barrels replaced Cockerill in about 1900 until about 1911. These dates are very rough. It was a period known as "the German School".
Pete
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