doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com OT - Duck bill shotgun muzzle

I did my ITR after 19 weeks of Boot at San Diego. You are 100% right about everything being up hill at Pendleton. Hump them hills, that's what 0311's learn to do.

Good stuff, oskar. God...the people you meet, the fucked up places you go, and crazy shit you do in the military. Wouldn�t trade those memories both happy and sad for anything.


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We were soldiers once...and young. Hal Moore

The duckbill was developed in the early 60's at the Naval base at China Lake, then moved to Crane Weapon Station. The prototype was listed on gunsinternational a couple of years ago with the blueprints and a picture of the China Lake quarterdeck inlay. IIRC it started at $5K. I grew up with the 37 and do a lot of searches for it, stumbled across that one.

It was developed for the then newly formed SEALs. Sr. Chief "Patches" Watson had the first and tested it in Nam. The SEALs standardized on the Ithaca 37 and he had China Lake create a pistol grip for his 37 to go with the duckbill.



In his book Walking Point he said the enemy never complained after being shot with 0000 buckshot and the duckbill.

The effectiveness of the pattern was brought up on another website a year or so ago. It really isn't optimal for birds or clays. But for spreading laterally has some merit but not many have the need for that.

We had a 37 in the locker on a Gator Freighter I was on. Everyone knew to keep their hands off it because it was "mine". When the Marines switched to the 9mm in the mid 80's they came on board and took the 37, M14's and .45's. Sad day.

The Mossberg 500 and Rem 870 replaced most of the shotguns from what I saw until I retired in 95. Few years later the Benelli M4 started to replace those from what my friends who were still active told me.

Thanks for that post, CI. Very informative, and interesting. Great pic.

Didn't know the military ever used 0000.

SRH

Back then the standard buckshot load for the Navy was #4. On a ship with steel compartments crack the hatch stick the muzzle in and bring a mop to clean up. By the time I came along 00 was the standard although there was still some 0000 around.

In Sr. Chiefs book Walking Point he stated that the spreader made quick shooting against moving targets in the dense jungle of Dung Island much more effective. As to the smaller #4 buck shot, Watson said it worked very well against the smaller Viet Cong. "I heard no complaints from any of them" he said.

I hunted deer for many years with 12 gauges, as we drove them with dogs. The standard accepted size was 00, but I found I got better patterns with 0, in most cases. When Federal came out with their copper plated buckshot loads, it was unreal how tight it stayed out of my gun. I could put more pellets on a paper plate at a given range, using their 2 3/4" load, than most 3" loads of regular unplated pellets, even tho' the 3" carried three pellets more.

Of course, I didn't have the same need as did a SEAL, or someone walking point in the jungle.

Just remembering .....

SRH

Interesting; the area around here used to be a goose mecca and a lot of seasoned hunters used #4 buck for pass shooting geese.

#4 Buck 20ga(reduced recoil Federal) is what my home defense Remington 870 extended mag is loaded with. At all times. No shell in the chamber though; maybe if something bad happens jacking in a live round will end the fight...Geo

When I was dog hunting for deer I used #1 Buck in a 12ga with satisfactory results.

George-- same way I keep my M25 riot gun in 12 gauge- 5 in the mag, chamber empty--and a Allen black nylon shell carrier with 5 extra rds. slipped in place on the ejection port side-on the butt (as I am right handed). No better weapon for an O-dark-30 SHTF scenario-IMO.

Noticed that the SEALs Chief in the photo had a M37 with the "duckbill", but I could not see the rest of the buttstock, just the pg covered by his right hand.

I concur with your thoughts of the sound of a round "going into the chamber" being a possible deterrent to "what comes next"--RWTF

I once had a deputy sheriff tell me that nothing "dispelled tensions" in a crowded juke-joint quite as much as stepping inside with a nickel-plated double barrel (S x S). Not sure where he got one, and there's not many of those kind of jukes left around here, but there used to be one every five miles or so. This was "no country for old men" for a long time, being over a half hour from the sheriff's department under the best of conditions.

True story............

Grandaddy bought this farm, and the house I'm living in, in 1919, as a young newly married man. It had been idle for several years since the country doctor who owned it and built this house died with tuberculosis, but there was a "squatter" who was living in this house for free, and supposedly care taking the place. When word got to him that Grandaddy had bought it he sent him word that if he set foot on the place he would "leave him lying in his tracks".

Grandaddy rode a horse 25 miles to the sheriff and told him the situation. Sheriff handed Grandaddy his personal sidearm and said "You can handle this, can't you?" Grandaddy rode on to Augusta and bought a Colt revolver for himself.

When Grandaddy rode down here to confront the squatter, he found him in the mule lot. Grandaddy said "I heard what you threatened. I bought this place, it's mine, and I am going to live here and farm it. We're going to settle this right now. If you want to shoot it out I have two pistols. If you want to cut it out I brought two knives, or if you want to fight it out with fists we will, but we're going to settle this now." Joe said he wanted to "fight it out". Grandaddy replied, "In the middle of the public road", turned about, and headed towards Stoney Bluff Road. They got halfway there and Joe said "No, I'll leave", and backed down. Can you imagine a high sheriff doing something like that today?

I live in the same house that was standing empty when Grandaddy bought this place 100 years ago, this year. The first year taxes are recorded as having been paid on it was 1875.

SRH