I was at a gun show in southeastern PA yesterday and saw two attractive Chas Daly 28 gauge shotguns. Both were 28 gauge with 28 inch barrels. The first, priced at $2495, was a baby frame. The second, priced at $1495 was a standard (20 gauge?) frame.

I liked both guns, but especially liked the baby frame. The engraving on it was quite good - far better than the Miroku guns I'm familiar with (Citoris, mostly). The engraving on the standard frame was almost as good. Wood on both was o.k., but not spectacular.

I am reluctant to tie up that much money in a gun with what is (apologies to John Mann and other Prussian Daly fans), at least today, distinctly 3rd tier. Are the early Miroku Dalys really going for that much, or was this simply a case of the seller hoping to get lucky at Christmas time?

Thanks.

Are these SxS or O/U format? What is the engraving, modest game scene or tight scroll? Is it a sideplate or sidelock by any chance?

I'm assuming that this is an O/U. The small frame Miroku Daly 28's are very desireable and the seller seems to know that (shocking, isn't it?). Compared to the other small frame 28 O/U's on the market these days, it is a nicer gun than the Ruger Red Label, but not as trim or pleasant to carry, as I recall. The Daly is not as nice as the small frame Rizzini 28, and is probably on a par with the current Beretta small frame 28. It is far, far better than a third tier gun. The Miroku and Daly engraving of that period was better than the Citoris that followed. The vent rib on the small frame Dalys was pretty fragile, so eyeball it carefully to be sure is hasn't been bumped. There are very few of the small frame Daly 28's around, and even fewer with the 28" barrels. If it's what you want, you might go quite a while before you see another nice one. $2500 is probably an OK price, but higher than I would pay. For hunting, I'd get another Ruger.

Jerry, O/U's I bet - don't recall ever seeing a 28 g Miroku SxS.

Remmy40x, I bet the 28" baby frame was pretty sweet. There's definitely a premium being placed on the small gauge, and I think it'd be hard to find another guy who's GOT to have a 28 ga Daly/Miroku willing to pay that premium.

These are great guns - when they're priced less than a NIB B-gun. For 1500ish you can get the Citori 28 ga on a 20 frame - or for 2500ish, the Beretta scaled frame 28.

I really like my mid 60s Miroku 28" 20 ga, but it was about 1/2 of what a new Citori cost.

Was the engraving like this?

Remington: I don't think any apologies are called for. The Daly's of today, and even the 60's are distinctly different than those that John Mann has been involved with. These are just user guns, and nice ones at that. I think you might find a 28 on a 20 frame for alot less money than that but the baby frames are a rare bird. I'm not sure it's worth that premium myself. The engraving is pretty nice on the 60s Mirokus and I think they are a well-made gun. At tad better than the Citoris in that they have a flat main spring and the Citoris all had coil springs.

Remington: I don't think any apologies are called for. The Daly's of today, and even the 60's are distinctly different than those that John Mann has been involved with. These are just user guns, and nice ones at that. I think you might find a 28 on a 20 frame for alot less money than that but the baby frames are a rare bird. I'm not sure it's worth that premium myself. The engraving is pretty nice on the 60s Mirokus and I think they are a well-made gun. At tad better than the Citoris in that they have a flat main spring and the Citoris all had coil springs.

Remington: I don't think any apologies are called for. The Daly's of today, and even the 60's are distinctly different than those that John Mann has been involved with. These are just user guns, and nice ones at that. I think you might find a 28 on a 20 frame for alot less money than that but the baby frames are a rare bird. I'm not sure it's worth that premium myself. The engraving is pretty nice on the 60s Mirokus and I think they are a well-made gun. At tad better than the Citoris in that they have a flat main spring and the Citoris all had coil springs.

Remington: I don't think any apologies are called for. The Daly's of today, and even the 60's are distinctly different than those that John Mann has been involved with. These are just user guns, and nice ones at that. I think you might find a 28 on a 20 frame for alot less money than that but the baby frames are a rare bird. I'm not sure it's worth that premium myself. The engraving is pretty nice on the 60s Mirokus and I think they are a well-made gun. At tad better than the Citoris in that they have a flat main spring and the Citoris all had coil springs.

Remington: I don't think any apologies are called for. The Daly's of today, and even the 60's are distinctly different than those that John Mann has been involved with. These are just user guns, and nice ones at that. I think you might find a 28 on a 20 frame for alot less money than that but the baby frames are a rare bird. I'm not sure it's worth that premium myself. The engraving is pretty nice on the 60s Mirokus and I think they are a well-made gun. At tad better than the Citoris in that they have a flat main spring and the Citoris all had coil springs.

Yeti, nor have I but there is always the possibility of something unusual occurring. The 28ga O/Us are a great gun value. Used a couple Miroku's for skeet competition in 1960s when they were available to me in Japan for $127 each. There are some higher grade stunning Miroku SxS sidelocks seldom seen in USA which might be available in 28ga SxS configurations.
Hollowell & Co has one on their website in 12ga under the European gun category. I would love to find a small gauge in that model.

Gil, are you alright man? That is a bad stutter you have this morning.

Jerry,
True 'nuff! I've seen the ads for one of those Miroku SLE's and it was very nice.

Ranging from here to there - My mid 60's Miroku (20 ga o/u) is marked Kawaguchiya Firearms Co (KFC) not Charles Daly and was reportedly bought in a PX, either in Japan or Korea. Did you see KFC guns during your time there?

Thanks in advance

Jerry and Yeti:

Definitely an over/under. Engraving was not as nice as that pictured - more in the style and pattern of that on the earlier Winchester 101s, but with more coverage, definition and shading. A very nice job, to say the least.

At $1,500 or so, I'd have tapped the credit line and bought it. At $2,500, I can't see doing the same.

I will admit that it was one of the sweeter handling guns I've handled over the time I've looked for a 28.

The dealer, should anyone be interested, was Jacobsburg Guns, Nazareth, PA. Ph: 610-759-2830. Bill McPoyle was his name. I've dealt with him a time or two and found him honest.

Rem

Baby frame Daly 28's are certainly more expensive than the larger frame 28s. The decision is with the buyer, but $2500 seems a bit excessive.

Rem40x,
This is the engraving on my KFC/Miroku. Some of the Daly's call this the Superior grade (and some Superior grades have different engraving). Thanks for the dealer info but 2500 is too rich for me too.

Yeti:

That looks much more like what I saw on Saturday.

Rem

Yeti, I don't recall seeing anything marked KFC. We had the Win 101s directly from the factory, Miroku (some were still marked as My Luck) and Charles Daly.

These are my views. As i own two and held about 8 others, small frame 28, They are way less then 1000 made as the blue book indicates, The book reads they start at 230020 but i have had some with 230481 and not be a small frame and 2304825 be a small frame. Just using the ser# as an example.

Any Real Baby frame miroku Daly 28 gauge Is a rare gun and Even better in hand and sweet to hold and handle, I love my Brownings and own them in 28 and 410 but The quality on the small frame early Miroku small frames surpass pre 65 RNLT Brownings, And a RNLT 28 gauge will command in 95 or better will bring 6k, and weigh 5,11 ounces, So Try and find a 95 of better Baby Daly and it will be the same price as it's a Heck of a rare little gun, The engraving is deep, Replaceable disc strikers, Most have super Great wood With small forends, And at 5,9 to 5,11 pounds,And a small little round knob How can you go wrong or want to own anything other in same type of gun, I do have pics to post if someone can do so.

Those baby frame 28s are some sweet guns. M.W. Reynolds sold one for $3600 but it was restock with some nicer wood.
http://www.mwreynolds.com/HTML/shotDalyBaby28leatherpad.html


I have a nice sxs marked "My Luck".... Model M-II


Adam

Yeti, I owned a KFC-marked gun which said "Miroku Model M" on the bottom of the receiver. I currently have a gun with the same KFC marking on the top rib, but with "Hibiki Model M" in a scroll on the side of the receiver. I think they're the same gun--both 12ga sxs, DT, str/splinter, look for all the world like a Birmingham boxlock. My previous one was an extractor gun, this one an ejector gun.