I found an old paper and brass shell at a flea market and picked it up just for curiosity. Can anyone tell me anything about it? On the bottom it reads "1901 No. 4 and Leader". The brass measures 1 3/8 high. Overall the shell measures 4 inches. Diameter of the brass at the bottom is 1 1/8 inches.

Look forword to hearing about this. Thanks for your time. George

Sounds like it could be an old Winchester Leader heavy waterfowl load, chiefly due to the shot size (#4) and the external case dimentions. Sounds like an 8 ga. to me from the measurements but you'd need someone more expert in the various shell lengths and gauges to weigh in here. KBM

I would think that #4 on the brass means 4 gauge.

Yup, big-un!

Only see one 4ga shell listed in the 1902 Hartley cataloge, it is the empty "First Quality" 4". My limited handful of other cataloges do not even mention 4ga.

Speaking of which, saw the Daly-duo 4 and 8 bore at the recent show here....that 8 looks like it cold be a 4 and the 4 is off the scale!

Very nice bit of craftsmanship though.

Best,
Mark

So some one else did attend that show. I was beginning to think I was the only non-vendor in the place. I asked about those 2. He told me the 4 bore weighs in at 22lbs and the 8 bore a mere 16lbs. Actually saw a decent Fox AE 12ga for a good price. Trouble was the seller won't stop talking on his cell phone to even answer a question. Finally get tired of waiting and walked away.

Not sure I would even have to fire that 4 bore to take an elephant. One look and the tusker would keel over with laughter at thought of me hauling that monster on a sled through the bush.

I checked "Cartridges of the World". The only 4" long shell he lists is a 4 bore.

Pete

I've got some 4" 8 bore, a 6" 10 bore and a 3" 16 bore in my collection.

Mike,

You have 6" 10ga shell? Who made it?

Pete

I'd have to look Pete. From memory it's red and I think Winchester made it. I'll look when I get home from work.

Pete it is a Winchester Nublack.