doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Classic & Custom Single Barreled Sporting Rifles @ doublegunshop.com muzzle loading bullets

Mike, lost my first response. Regarding the statements about Pope barrels at Mid and Long Range using modern calibers and Jacketed Bullets. I have a Jersey City Pope Hiwall in .25 Niedner Krag. It has all the Woodchuck rifle changes, steep turned Pistol grip, shortened lower and upper Tang, Double Sets, big fat cheek piece stock. I borrowed some Niedner tools for making cases and formed up a batch. As a guess I loaded 39 Grs of 3031 behind a Remington 100 Gr soft point hunting bullet. At the range witha 20x Lyman STS I got it zeroed and then had a friend who was a good bench shooter take over. He fired a 10 shot group that measured one caliber wide and 1/2" long vertically. The neck area of the case is so tight that you cannot push a .25 caliber jacketed bullet into the as fired case by hand. Guess he had not lost his touch at Jersey City. Regards, FITZ.

ho ho iisj.

got hold of dave mos. what started out to be a 5 minuite call turned into a couple of hours. talking to dave is like talking to glen flewless, j. d. steele or the fitz. a short call gets long in a hurry.. always learn so much talking to these guys i can't get of the phone.

any way, when dave was working at ballard rifle. he made a dozen pope fm's for ballard 'after' the rifles were made. rite now he has one of steve garbe's barrels there for a false muzzle.

i had forgotten, popes fm's are round. made me feel like a fool. now i know how an oct barrel can be cut for a fm..

back to the story.. the great thing is,,,, dave has copies of pope's prints and drawings for the false muzzle, bullet starter, short starter and ramrod. also for a couple of pope's bullets.

he makes some bullets simular to pope's but claims a tad better. remember, his 25's regualy shoot 250's and jim borton used daves mold to set a new 100 shot hudson record. people using his bullets claim, 'no mold maker can equal daves molds for accuracy or dropping out of the mold'. (thats important ) if you ever beat a bullet out of a brooks mold, you know what i mean.

rite now he's making 30 actions of his own design. they sound great.. wuld like to get him on a conferance call with some of the guys on this site. no telling what mite come out of it..

..ttfn..grampa..

PS... his molds are cut on a lathe not with a cheery.

Fitz, I sure would like to see your Pope High-Wall in .25 Niedner Krag. Sounds like a Niedner chamber if you can't get the bullets into a fired case. Do you know who it was made for? I'll show you mine if you show me yours ;-).

.25 Niedner Krag, not a Pope barrel, Dr. Baker's rifle.

almost forgot,

he uses the same bit to cut the bullet starter, short starter and ramrad as he uses to cut the bullet nose. that way, the bullet is lined up dead center in the bore..

tt.g

PS.. my neighbor is danish, i keep threatining to feed him 'lutkefisk'..
..

Lucky Neighbor!

Geeez Mike, you keep doing this to me. Thats a neat Borchardt. The Manual cocked striker is a new one to me. Does it have to be manually cocked or do the side plate cams still work? I have no idea who my Pope .25 Niedner Krag was made for. Will send you pics if my Daughter can train me to get the Pics out of my Digital Camera into the computer. Of course you know she has shown me more than a few times. DUH? She is due home for Thanksgiving so may be able to send some this week. Wishing you a Happy Thanksgiving. Regards, FITZ.

Fitz, Because the Borchardt safety was removed the cocking knob acts a safety for a rifle that's going to be used in the field. The cocking cams have been removed and Niedner made a new breechblock with floating type firing pin that does not rest on the primer. Zischang on the other hand built a safety into the front of the trigger guard. If you can send me pictures, I'll post them for you.

This is a hunting rifle built by Zischange, notice the safety. This is IMO one of the finest single-shot sporting rifles I have ever had the pleasure to examine. The owner can tell you more about it.

The Zischang Borchardt is in .25 - 35. Other than the safety, the action modifications are the same as those found on his schuetzen rifles. The tang sight base is Lyman - the staff being in a drawer somewhere. This is a very trim little rifle.

What is the form of the rifling in your Pope .25 - Krag? Right hand twist rather than his customary left handed? Six lands and grooves vs eight? I have several of his barrels in "smokeless" configurations, and they are different from those made for "Black powder cartridges".

I just want to say thanks' to all for the help and information on this forum I will post results and pictures as the projects take form.

xxgranpa, do you think it is possible to get a copy of those papers from Dave and how do I get in contact with him does he have a web page?

I am not sure that I understand you’re meaning on the throat do you mean at the muzzle or the throat at the breech where the cartridge ends?

Fitz I am looking forward to the pictures if it has no public interest you are welcome to mail them direct to me at
mrj ad lite dot dk

Brent lutkefisk is a Norway specialty you should give him "klipfisk" instead or "roeget sild"

Michael

Michael, I know what lutkefisk is. I rather like it as a matter of fact! Rokkefiske is another Norsk wonder.