doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion German & Austrian Sporting Guns @ doublegunshop.com Question on Simson shotgun

I have recently became the proud owner of a Simson shotgun and have a couple of questions. Can I cut a long forcing cone in these barrels with out causing any undue damage? The gun locks up tight and is on face. I had a couple of dents taken out and it looks like it is ready to be put back to work. The green tape is temporarily (I use duct tape for perminent work) holding a butt plate on the original was missing and I found a horn plate that will fit.
If anyone can provide any additional information on the gun I would apprecate it.

Are your patterns blown? You have 70mm chambers so what is your reason for extending the forcing cones? Are they short? It was proofed/proved in June of 1931.

Kind Regards,


Raimey
rse

The chambers are 2 3/4 but cut for the fiber wads and paper shells or so I am told. The forcing cone is not a gentle taper like modern barrels but more squared off. I have not shot the gun as having read stories about modern plastic shells in the older chamberscan creat a problem with excessive recoil and harder on the gun.
That is why I was asking did not know if it was an old wives tale or fact. Wanted to find out a little more before taking it out I can load for it if necessary just want to do it right.
I had planned on using it as a donor gun for either rifle or bore gun but since it is in good condition and the barrels are good I plan on leaving a shotgun.
hope this makes sense

If this were my shotgun, I would not alter the forcing cones, I would just shoot 2.5" shells in the 2.75' chambers and not worry about the configuration of the taper of the cones. Have you had the NBD measured, as well as the choke tapers? Many European 12 gauge shotguns, especially pre-WW11, ran closer to a .7250" NBD, whereas our American 12 gauge shotguns were closer to a .7300" NBD--Do you have period buttplate for this Simpson, or are you going to install a pad for a longer LOP. Nice clean lines, and good to see the cheekpiece sans the usual ruptured eagles and leaping unicorns the German stockers liked to deep carve into such areas--

I do not have the period butt plate altho I do have an unmarked horn plate. I will have to wait until I shoot it before deciding on a recoil pad.
I will measure the chokes havent got that far yet.

Does this gun have a retailer's name stamped on it? I ask because many of the Simsons with 70mm chambers were intended for export.

I'd leave the gun as-is and buy some spreader wads (or cartridges) if it has the (normal) very tight chokes. Doubt if the chokes or forcing cones will increase the recoil noticeably, especially if you are using it for hunting.

A great gun by a great German company erased by the Nazis and then the Communists. Hope the Simsons are still doing well here in LA! Unlike the Nazis, we were glad to have them. (I doubt if they would have done much better under the East Germans if by some odd chance they had survived Hitler).

Mike A.
yes I know what you mean and no it does not have a retailer name on it. The barrels do have "Fluss-Stahl Krupp-Esson" which I think was the barrel material.
It seems to be a well made gun altho had quite a bit of use but not abused.
I see that Balistic company has 2 1/2 inch shells I will have to get a few and work up a load. I build rifles but shotguns are a different thing altogether. Just about the time I think I have learned everything something new shows up.

rgh, your gun has 2 3/4" chambers, which is why I think it was originally intended for export; most German 12s for domestic use in that period still had 65mm or 2 1/2" chambers. If it is still tight and on-face, regular US shells should be OK. I'd stick to the more moderate loads, since it isn't really good for waterfowling with steel. Mine patterns "heavy trap" 1 1/8 oz. loads very well for upland shooting; I use scatter load equivalents in the first barrel when hunting in tighter cover. Like many, mine is choked "full and fuller" and has 29+" barrels. Retailed in Salonika by an "armurie" with an Armenian name!

I measured the chokes on this gun they both measured .687 at the muzzle. I used a telescoping guage and micrometer as I dont have a regular choke guage. The measurement looks like they are really tight, the barrel lenght is 30 inches. Is this normal for the German guns?

rgh25,

Yes, tight chokes are the norm for early Geramn shotguns.

In the thread:

http://www.doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=248829#Post248829

Kuduae (Axel) writes:

... "The tight choke in drillings was common to nearly all German shotguns up to the 1960s. The main purpose of shot barrels in Germany then was shooting hare, sort of a large rabbit living in open fields."

Regards,

Buchseman