doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Manhattan Arms Proof Marks

Have a sidelock hammerless here in 10 gauge bearing serial #311XX. There's a good chance this gun is Sauer made - - This is suggested both by appearance and one proof mark that shows a standing male figure holding what seems a long-handled tool with a curved blade at its base. A reference source also suggests the gun was made about 1885, if Sauer made.

There is one extra mark that I would like to understand. It consists of a pair of crossed swords under "S & S" and with a very small and unidentifiable symbol on top of both. This gun bears no proof marks made after the introduction of the German Proofmark Law of 1891.

All help appreciated.

Sounds like a JP Sauer to me. The S&S is Sauer & Sons mark. The standing figure sounds like the standard Sauer logo mark. I had a Manhattan Arms 12 ga that was Sauer manufactured and have seen a couple of others. Other than the small Sauer marks there is nothing that really tells you it's made by them. No proofs if before '91. MOst people pass them by as some Belgian beauty because of the Manhattan name on the side.

My 10 #321xx has those same marks plus what appears to be a dragon or falcon and also two crowns one larger than the other on the water table.Markings on the barrels are 192 S HUF 245c on the left 192 S HUF s on the right

Email me some pics and Ill post them for you. I saw that gun a couple days before you mentioned it here and was almost tempted to buy it. Glad someone from here picked it up. Ross

ross@berck.org

Thanks fellas.

The remaining marks Mike notes are identical to those on my 10. One barrel, however, bears one 4-digit number and the other, five. Ross, the pictures which the firm had posted are now removed. Don't have other means of taking/sending photos. I appreciate the offer a lot.

What I've read to date indicates that Schoveling Daly and Gales was a prominent importer. Also, VL&D is sometimes mentioned. Would speculate there's no way of telling which source - or another source - sold a given gun here in the U.S.

Were these guns identical to any model made by and marked as a Sauer?

Thanks again.