doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com 2-inch 12 versus 16-bore in the uplands

There are also some (not many) Spanish 2" 12's floating around. Arrieta has made some. They're heavier than the Brit 2" guns, and carry the modern CIP standard proof for a 12 bore. Friend of mine had one. They're unique, but I think I'd probably go with a 16. On the other hand, I have a Webley & Scott 700 that doesn't weigh 6 1/4# and is chambered 2 3/4" which makes it quite versatile--although I'll stick with 1 1/8 oz loads at the most, and more likely 1 or 1 1/16 oz.

There are really light 20's and 28's out there, with ammo readily available. Seems to me that's the route to go if you want a light gun to shoot light loads.

Small Bore mentions that he's only seen 2-inch guns as low to mid-grade boxlocks, and they may be the more-common option, but I've also seen many best-gun examples, including Dominion H&Hs and Beasley-patent Purdeys. From the perspective of an upland gunner who walks much more than he shoots, these are very attractive guns. I freely admit to being drawn-in by their "coolness" factor, but if you haven't picked one up, you really don't know what you're missing.

One of my faverate grouse and woodcock guns is My Churchill XXV 2 inch 12 Imperial sidelock. It smokes skeet targets with its 7/8 oz. of shot,[RST] and seems to do pretty well on wild birds as well. Luckily, it fits me well, so I let "the force" prevail. Oh yeah,it weighs 5# 4 oz.

Best,

Mal

Lloyd,

I hope you didn't think I was taking a shot by mentioning the "coolness factor". I think 2" 12 gauge guns are cool & that 2" H&H Royal my friend had was "really cool". He didn't like it though & sold it very quickly after importing it from England.

B-Man: No offence here! The "coolness factor" is undeniable for most of these guns, I fear. BTW, you're right about the RST lifeline. If I had to hand load 2-inch shells, I'd be far-less enthusiastic.

I'm surprised my friend RCC hasn't chimed in...

Weight is one thing, but not the only thing. There is the fact that .662 is just more svelte than .729.

I had a 2", mid to lower range box lock, exactly like smallbore describes. It was neat and had that magic wand factor we all look for. It was made for a person built like my grandfather, 5' 5" to 5' 7", 150-175 at best so it did not fit me that well. Still it was a joy to carry and almost as much to shoot. The birds and clays were well hit. It did like RST and custom loaded Federal Paper shells. After a few years the magic died and the gun just sat in the gun room too much like many others. So dow the road it went. But to be honest just about every gun I pickup to buy does seem to have magic in it for me, most of the time.

"16-bore ammo is easier to get and there is a wider range available."

Now when you site ease of finding 16 ammo as a reason to buy one verses another ga. you are getting into hard to find ammo. Most decline the 16 because the ammo is scare on the shelves. 2" ammo for the most part is order only on line. Just not going to find a few boxes on any shelve in the back of beyond.

You, nor can many of us,read without cheaters, our eyesight is so bad.

I don't believe you can see a .060 difference from a foot and a half (cheek on stock) to several feet (gun in crook of arm)no matter what you say, my fine friend.

And once again, I have and can continue to find much finer light 12s than 16s of equal quality. I have found and own three really nice 16s, but no less than ......well a whole lot more fine light 12s.

BTW Lloyd3, my favorite Upland gun is a 5 pound 9 ounce 12 bore Lindner FW with 2.5 chambers and there is not a 16 in existence that is any deadlier on pheasants across the Northern Plains.

In point of fact - I said 'almost all' were lower-middle quality box locks. I have seen the occasional better quality one and a best Purdey or two. They are not exactly thick on the ground though.

As far as patterning goes, I would be astonished if you could prove a significant difference. Words like "flat" and "even" have very little place in describing a pattern; from any gun. Cool, unique, etc.? Yep. Pattern? Nope. I know of only one guy who can really manage light, low swing effort (low MOI) guns. I strongly advise shooting a borrowed gun long enough to tell if you can really manage such guns before buy.

DDA