doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Help with J.P. Sauer I.D.

I just picked up a gem of a 12 gauge shotgun, but the markings don't make sense to me. It is marked on the left barrel 'Vorm.J.P.Sauer&Sohn - Suhl' and right barrel 'Special-Gewehr Lauf-Sthal SG1' The production date is 268 or Feb. of 1968 and has the proof marking of East Germany, though we know that J.P. Sauer moved to Eckenford at the end of the WWII. What have we got here? It's a beautiful gun, in every way the build of a J.P. Sauer but certainly making us scratch or heads given we didn't think any Sauer's were made in Suhl after WWII. Will post pictures as soon as possible. All enlightenment welcomed.

Thanks,
Dave B.

The Sauer name was also put on post war guns made in Suhl. They were made in the same facility as Merkels and some were clones of Merkels.

Thanks Mark for the info. Below are some pics, hope they show up okay.

Dave B.

Yup;
That gun could just as well be marked "Merkel 147" or 147e if it has ejectors....

Mark,
I was checking out your website and I noticed this Fortuna there. It is very similar to my gun and is from about the same year. Were the Fortuna's, Merkel's, and Sauer's made in the same factory?

Thanks,
Dave B

Gunnut,
yup this gun has ejectors. I guess you learn something new every day. That is why I love this bbs!

Thanks,
Dave B.

Whats stamped on the left side of the rear lump?

Greg,
the stamp is a number "1" inside the letter "Q" with DDR underneath that. According to Wirnsberger's book it is the East German mark for "Outstanding Quality".

Dave B

The Fortuna gunworks was established in Suhl by the Russians after the post WWII division of Germany.

I've read that a number of Sauer executives fled to the west where they re-established themselves in Eckenforde. Hence we have JP Sauers from both sides of the wall.

I assume that not all the craftsmen were as fortunate. I would then guess that it is those craftsmen (that got stuck in E. Germany) that became the men behind the Fortuna guns.

I have a beautiful 12 gauge SxS that is marked JP Sauer on the receiver and has the words Fortuna Fermely / JP Sauer & Sohn Suhl Germany on the rib.

I guess "Fermely" means Firm or Factory?????

My Sauer is quite different from other Sauers in that it has a straight hand/splinter forend stock, no cheekpiece, no cocking indicators. It is also rather light at 6 pound 7 ounces.

I wish I knew how many different "brands" were produced by the Fortuna works and how did they figure out what "brand" was going to be attached to a particular gun.

With so many German gunmaking records destroyed, I guess we may never know.

Dave,

That is a fine looking Sauer! Congrats!!


Bryan

Bryan,
thanks for the kind words about my gun. What you say makes sense to me. Not everyone that worked for Sauer probably made the move to West Germany. I also wonder why Merkel would make guns and stick the Sauer name on it. Unless they were not allowed to ship guns too certain countries under there own name. Very interesting indeed.

Thanks,
Dave B