doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Baker barrel test

Hello Gentlemen
I have been away awhile battling hunting and then lung cancer which I am sill fighting, now I start with Chemo The board seem to have changed I do not see as may technical discussions as when I left so I thought I would start one and just see were it goes. I was just reading my spring issue of Double Gun (no it was not late my wife received it and buried it under a lot of other papers while I was in the hospital) I see Mr. Bell is blowing up guns again. I was wondering if any one has ever tested any of the Bakers and if so what were the results. I now most people don't think much of the Baker, except those who collect Bakers and WE try to keep them a secret. But the fact of the matter is that Baker was instrumental in starting two of the top 5 guns co., one being the L.C. Smith, and the other the Ithaca gun company. But you never hear much about them. I am only collecting Bakers with steel barrel because I love to shoot them and am afraid to shoot the Damascus or twist one because I have not seen any reports on them, nor is there a decent gun smith in south jersey to check it out. From what I have read and learned from the members of this board, the older
Bakers were made with top quality Damascus barrels, so I wound conclude that the Bakers should be just as strong as the LC Smith, Ithaca even the famous Parker. Tell me what are your thoughts on this. After seeing the paragons on this post I would Like to own a couple, Instead of having only go after the Folsom ones.
Pete

Pete,

I have nothing scientific to tell you about Bakers, but I owned a 16ga that I really liked, shot well, and wish I could have kept,but I have decided to reduce my inventory and refine it some. It had steel barrels and I never gave the possiblity of a problem with them a thought. As to the damascus Baker barrels, I had an uncle who used a Baker all his life and when the Winchester Super XX shells arrived on the market he purchased 1&1/4 oz loads and never corrected the choice. He never had a problem with the gun at all. His grandson use it for the last 5 most recent years till about last season he broke the forarm iron so he now uses a stevens 311(to my relief). I guess it is retired now or i hope it is at least from the heavy use, but no problems with the barrels. Bakers are as good as any of the guns from that era in my humble opinion.

Keep up the good fight, there are many more days afield ahead I am certain!

Kurt

Hope you included Remington in your top 5 gun co. JMHO, damascus and twist barrels are just as good as any other barrel made back then. If any barrel rings true, there are no bad visable spots, and appears thick enough, shoot it. There are around 15 twist or damascus SxS's shot on a regular basis at my club, and not a one of them was checked by a gunsmith. Some are quite thin at the muzzle, but then, most the pressure is gone by then. Although not very technical, thought I'd say something- Paul

These are very interesting "Twist-Damascus" brls from a B grade Baker-laminated Twist and One Iron Crolle. I've not seen this damascus pattern on Lefever H Grade, Parker PH Grade, Ithaca Grade One, or 1895-1899 LC Smith 0 Grade guns.



These are from a Presentation Grade and appear to be extra-fine 3 Iron Crolle, similar to high grade Parkers or LCs

Pete,
I am relatively new to using/collecting Bakers. However, I currently own and have used a B grade and a Paragon grade, with twist and damascus barrels respectively, for three years. The barrels on both guns are very thick at the breech and thicker than most modern steel barrels at the muzzle. According to knowlegeable experts(Darryl Hallquist and James Tyson)both guns were manufactured in the first decade of the 20th century. I have shot both guns without problems. I use either low pressure smokeless powder shells or Black Powder shells.
I am newly registered on this site but have browsed this forum for years and I remember that not too long ago someone on this forum blew up the right barrel on a Baker A grade with Smokeless powder. I am biased I suppose but the pictures of the shells he had shot showed brass heads heavily deformed after firing, suggesting these reloaded shells had been overloaded.
If you are looking for high grade Baker guns, Greg Martin Auctions is having an auction sale in June with a presentation grade Baker and eight or nine Paragon grades, along with about the same number of A, B and R grades. you can view these guns at http://www.gregmartinauctions.com.
I have a feeling Bakers are becoming more well known. Houchins talks about Bakers and praises the guns(the earliest hammer guns through the last generation of hammerless guns built by H&D Folsom) in his book on L.C. Smith guns that was just published recently.
I hope everything goes well for you and I hope those of us who like Bakers keep in touch. I know I would like to learn more about the man and the company that bore his name.
Joe

Baker references are --

The Double Gun Journal -- Vol 3, Iss 3&4; Vol 9, Iss 2; and Vol 14, Iss 4
American Rifleman -- June 1968
Shooting Times -- May 1962
The Gun Report -- Nov 1989 and Jan 1991
Field & Stream -- April 1908
Guns Illustrated - 29th Edition, 1997

William H. Baker was dead before any of the sidelock hammerless Baker doubles built in Batavia saw the light of day. Even the trigger-plate hammer gun built first in Syracuse and then later in Batavia was designed by A.C. McFarland, Patent No. 370,966 granted Oct. 4, 1887. When the plant in Syracuse burned and they moved operations to Batavia, W.H. Baker was ill with TB and they brought in Frank A. Hollenbeck as plant superintendant. Hollenbeck had three patents granted while he was in Batavia and two are assigned to the Baker Gun & Forging Co.

I have my greatgrandfathers very early Baker, Batavia Leader. It was an inexpensive gun made with twist steel barrels.

It took countless grouse in Michigan as the second growth forest started to make a comeback. My father shot it with all kinds of shells up to around 1960, so it saw a lot of use. The barrels shine like new inside but show a couple of disturbingly deep patches so I don't shoot it. I just keep it with my great grandathers Filson and appreciate it.

Now my real point, barrels aside. This gun locks up nicer than any side by side I have ever owned or handled. The fit is impeccable and the gun closes with a sound and feel that impresses every person that holds it.

I don't know much about later Bakers, but there is some serious craftsmanship in the locks on this low grade gun...

My GG with the Baker and one of his hunting buddies:

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/jeffmulliken/album/576460762364824299/photo/294928803899685772/1

This is "Old Man Adams" with his hammer Parker, the Baker is laying on the ground to his left.

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/jeffmulliken/album/576460762364824299/photo/294928803899714534/0

Jeff

Jeff, dang is there something wrong with my computer? The pictures won't come up.

Didn't come up on mine either, but I did get an appology.

Try again:

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/jeffmulliken/photo/294928803899685772/2

http://new.photos.yahoo.com/jeffmulliken/album/576460762364824299/photo/294928803899714534/0