doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Got one of these on the way...

In the 1908 Sear's catalog, quite possibly other years as well, they listed a "Little Ladies" single shot shotgun. This was available chambered for either the .44XL or for a .40-85 Win case. This case was in all likelihood the same as the .40-85 Ballard. This was, of course, a rimmed case having a head diameter of 0.480" & a length of about 2 15/16". (Almost a 3" .410) Sears only supplied these as primed empties & had to be loaded. A load was given which consisted of an appropriate charge of black powder with � oz of shot.

I had an old British SXS hammer gun that I believe was originally proofed as a .44, it also had 2-3/4� chambers. I shot .410's through it and it worked just fine. The only thing was the .410 casing�s would swell slightly and wouldn�t fit in a .410 Nitro Special after they�d been fired in the old hammer gun.
Steve

Researcher had an excellent thread on Shotgunworld about the evolution of 44XL, .44-40, and .410 shotshells, but the images were lost in the Photobucket fiasco

The 44XL and 28g "Small Double" were first listed in the 1910 H. & D. Folsom catalog. Catalog No. 13 1916 listed the gun in .410.



To be clear, 44XL shotshells could be used in the (new) .410/12mm chambered guns, but not v.v.

Folsom catalog No. 18 c. 1921 listed the "Midget Field Model" for 44 XL or .410 - "The one gun takes both sizes."



Here's a thread about using resized .44-40 brass
http://jefenry.com/main/The44-Shot.php

I have one of those 28 gauge American Gun Company hammer doubles, but the stock is broken. I have wanted to see if I could repair it or else make a new one, but haven't done it yet. I weighed all the parts of this one & it went to right at 5 lbs. That's what a 28 gauge should weigh if it's going to weigh 6 lbs or + it would be better as a 20.

Shooting a 5 lb gun isn�t tough. Shooting a 5 lb gun exceptionally well, is tough.

Best,
Ted

Ted;
There are of course a lot of different ways of looking at this. I have done a good bit of "Good" shooting with guns weighing from around 6 lb up through 7� lbs. They were all however in 20, 16 & 12 gauges. My personal preference is "IF" I cannot shoot well with a gun lighter than 6 lbs I have no use for anything smaller than a 20. To me personally, the "ONLY" advantage of a smaller gauge is lightweight. Why would I want to pay a premium for the gun & then $12.00-$15.00 a box for shells, not quite the equal of what I can buy for around $5.50 a box, With all the advantages favoring the larger gauge?

Miller,
I�m cut from the same cloth. It is hard for me to pick up a box of either 28 or .410 ammunition, and reach for my wallet, when there is 12 and 20 gauge ammunition right next to it, for less money.
I own a .410, and a 28. Shoot either, very little. But, that 12 gauge single shot Companion 12 gauge, at about 5 lbs and small change, is a demanding little minx as well.

Best,
Ted

I've asked myself that question for years. The only answers that make any sense to me are 1) Challenging myself by using a gun that will make taking game or targets tougher. Or 2) Owning and using a gun that is more likely to appreciate in value over time.

Of course, If I put enough shells through it that cost nearly 3 times as much as the next larger gauge, I will quickly eat up any appreciation in value. I don't know if components to load for 28 gauge are much more expensive, but if I ever find the right gun at the right price, I have a Bair reloading press set up for 28 gauge, and a 28 gauge die set for a Mec. I don't know if jOe's new/old .44 shot gun has any real collector value, but I think it would be interesting and fun to load and shoot.

It makes economic sense to reload .410, 28 and 16, especially if one shoots a lot or makes specialty loads and is into loading for the long haul. For 12 and 20 unless one is making a specialty load such as low pressure or lighter payloads, it's not. Gil

Fact: All 5 lb. guns, or even sub 5 lb. guns, do not handle the same. I have a 4lb. 14 oz. 28" barreled S X S that Rocketman spun for me on his MOI turntable. As he did so I commented that it surprised me that I shot it well, since I'm used to shooting much heavier guns. He commented that it was because it had almost the same numbers as a 12 ga. English game gun. It's where the weight is located on the gun that matters to handling, much more so than just the total weight.

Fact: Anyone who pays $12 a $15 a box for .410" shells is just lazy. I never pay over $8 for good 1/2 oz. factory loads, by the flat. They pattern great out of my guns. Beyond that, you can reload .410s so cheaply it is ridiculous. I do pay more for premium 3/4 oz. loads, while I am working up a good reload. But soon I will be loading .410 hunting loads, with nickel plated shot, for less than you can buy a cheap box of chilled shot 12s.

Fact: If your life is ruled by practicality you will probably never enjoy a .410. You should probably stick with $289 12 ga. pump guns. But, if you like a challenge, if you like making it a little tougher on yourself to take a limit, or run a straight at skeet, you just might find the little guns grow on you.

Fact: You don't have to pay a premium for a good .410 or 28 doublegun. I never have, and I've got 6 of them right now.

Different strokes for different folks.

SRH