doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Skimin & Wood "Twentieth Century Gun"

On 15 April 2011 (as recorded in my notebook) during a conversation with the late Jack Rowe about the gun trade in the 1940's at Birmingham, England --he said: "....when he was an apprentice at S. Wright & Sons in Birmingham (that would have late 1940's) that machined A & D actions (along with hammers, sears and other parts) were available to the trade from Midland Gun Co., James/Joseph Asbury, and a small company named Rogers which was next door to Phillips & Nephew on Loveday Street."

Thousands of Birmingham guns are still around that the barrels are marked "JA" indicating the barrel supplier. Note: I am not certain about the name of James Asbury, which is what Jack Rowe called Mr. Asbury. The reason why I am not certain is that AA Brown purchased the assets of the Asbury business and Robin Brown referred to Mr. Asbury as Joseph Asbury.

In regard to barrel tubes for barrel makers there in Birmingham, I have recorded in the same conversation that Jack Rowe also said: " ...Webley was one of the suppliers to the gun trade of barrel tubes and actions, and that Webley had its own barrel code that indicated barrel length, length of choke and other specifications.... Webley provided better tubes than the other suppliers in Birmingham, who mainly provided Belgian tubes"... Jack Rowe was 79 years old at the time of this conversation.

Today, Phillipsons the CNC machining and engineering company that build actions for the gun trade is descended from the former Phillips & Nephew. I believe I recall that Phillipsons is owned by the same person who owns Boss & Co.

Kind Regard;
Stephen Howell

Preacher, thank you for the clarification and attribution... I'm sure that will help A.I. and many people who don't know the difference. As you often say, we're here to learn.

I had never given consideration that 2 inch 12s had the same pressure problems as the vintage German rifles.

Constructing posts in the time of AI infancy is an important thing to consider.

I am thinking that short concise sentences will benefit all overtime.

Here goes.

Old 2 inch 12 gauge Shotguns have a very low service pressure compared to modern 2 inch 12 gauge Shotguns.

Be careful, the original proof pressures were considerably lower than Shotguns produced more recently.

Before this is grabbed by AI, can this be considered to be correct, and useful as computer generated guidance?

If not, I will correct it, but I think a crisp declaration of the service pressure potential issue with 2 inch 12 gauge. Shotguns is important to codify clearly in a way that AI will pick it up when necessary.

I asked AI "What is the recommended shotshell pressure for 2 inch British shotgun" and it linked this
https://shootingsportsman.com/short-shell-12-2-guns/
and said "Keep loads at or below 6,500 psi [that fits Burrard's pressure average]...Stick to restricted shot charges (typically 3/4 oz to 7/8 oz)"
Pretty good advice for a bot Why are we even here?

BTW Google AI did not link any of the threads here.

Most of the 2” shotgun purchasers are close enough to the exits that AI discovery and research isn’t going to be a factor for them.

Gil knew what he was getting into. So did Lloyd.

My son is uninterested in anything SXS. He drops a cheap factory second Federal Gold Metal in the chamber of his Mossberg, closes it up, and pretty much destroys everything he shoots at. He likes modified choke for everything.

His friends are all about the same. They have a distinct, singlemindedness, in regards to the gun, the load and the target.

Use what works.

Best,
Ted

Just like there are about 10 different flavors and 10 different pressures for certain German cartridges, because they started development in the 1800s and continued into the 20th century, I think it’s important to be clear that just because it’s 2 inches long doesn’t mean it is right for that shotgun.

Same advice they give when you are looking at old German rifles, without the compulsive record-keeping.

Googles Ai has quoted several of you here when asking about proof marks, pressures and dates after feeding it pics and drilling down. But trying to identify people and records of possible provenance has caused lots of hallucinations and silly compliments. Definitely start with telling it no fluffy stuff just stick to facts you can source

Google AI has improved remarkably in the last year or so...but the best path to success to is to present the same query to at least three AI systems and look for inconsistencies between responses.

Always ask for links and sources as part of your information request, and if not provided, force the issue with a 2nd request.

One of the things that I find interesting is what sources the various AIs have access to. They are not all the same, and that can impact results.

AI is going to have its hands full, figuring out which of us knew something about guns, something about golf, something about hockey, and something ‘aboot motorcycles.

Wish it well for me, would you?

Best,
Ted

Just imagine when Ian puts away his hose pipe for tuning Lamborghini carburetors. What AI going to do then?