I was talking about what GregSy said, David. And Dave, I know what you mean. I worked in a steel mill for thirty years and made pretty good money. But I saw kids get a job there and start buying things that put got them into trouble. Realtors (mainly, a couple of women I dated over the years) around here never heard of such a thing of not getting a loan that would put a huge burden on young kids. I remember in the spring of 2006, we were in the process of getting locked out by our company (AK Steel) and one guy I worked with went out, within a year of the lockout, and bought a new car for his wife, a new pickup truck for himself, a new boat (a month before the lockout) after he had just bought a new home. All this on less than a $50,000/year job. Credit cards really get people into trouble, too.