doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Best / strongest double shotgun action ever made?

Fact is...any gun that hinges on a pin where the metal can wear away from either the pin itself or on the hook will, if used enough, become loose on the face and require some sort of fix. A Darne will never become loose, despite what "others" aka "Geno" say. Still have never seen or heard (from a credible source") of a loose Darne. jOe, there are no loose Darnes. When it comes to Darnes, the only thing I've ever seen wrong with one that would keep it from being operated safely is severe neglect. The spiral springs inside the breach block come from a Lebel rifle, they are hell for stout and if they happen to break...they still keep on working. I'm sorry gang, until someone shows up with a legitimately worn out Darne, and by legitimate I mean worn out from normal, everyday use, not neglect, you are going to have a hard time convincing anyone who cares that there is a stronger more robust double gun out there.
I've seen a few worn out Purdeys though, even sleeved ones. I know where there's one right now waiting to be restocked, it wobbles on the face and sounds like worn out cv joints on a car, and it needs new mainsprings too, but the gun sure does look pretty on the outside.

If a Darne was so great the rest of the world would've copied it.

Good Lord jOey, IT WAS COPIED. Do your homework jOe, there are a few countries in which the Darne was copied. You get a F minus if your homework is turned in before 1st period tomorrow. No chance for a "A" in your case jOe, F minus is as good as its gonna get.

Hey...anybody seen Geno anywhere?

He's probably tired of wasting his time talking about the Darne bumper jAcks.

Ya, your probably right jOe. Hey, he shouldn't feel so bad, I'm the one who lost a star over all this HuLlaBaLoO. Have a great weekend JoEy ol' boy.

I'll tell you what, Miller-The MAIN thing I implied is that Regis applied for, and received a patent for his version of the monoblock, in 1902.

That fact is indisputable. The 1902 Patent is mentioned in every single catalog I have, going back to 1909.

My secondary point, that you chose to ignore, is that Regis Darne died FABULOUSLY wealthy in the late 1930s. That he made a ton of money off the patent for the monoblock issued to him, is indisputable, also. Pieper was an also-ran in the gun business, by any way of comparison, with Regis Darne.

I explained to you that I didn't know exactly how they differed, but, Pieper's is illustrated in patent literature with damascus materials, and Darne's is not. I do know Darne applied for, and had his patent renewed, in the 1930s.

So, to make you happy, today, lets say Pieper patented a monoblock of some sort, that must have differed in some critical way from a monoblock that was later patented by Regis Darne. Belgium and France aren't on opposite sides of the world, I'm sure Darne knew about Pieper's patent and Pieper knew about Darne's. And, for some reason, a lot more examples, like, say, 975,000, of the Darne patent monoblock exist today.

For whatever reason.

You happy now?

Best,
Ted

Hey Dustin!
If Ed "the Torch" has a star, they don't mean squat, anyway.

Have a great weekend. Trying to educate jOe is like herding cats.

Pointless.

Best,
Ted

"I'll tell you what, Miller-The MAIN thing I implied is that Regis applied for, and received a patent for his version of the monoblock, in 1902.
That fact is indisputable.

Patent number: 246195
Filing date: Apr 23, 1881
Issue date: Aug 23, 1881
http://www.google.com/patents?id=QiBMAAA...;q=&f=false

My secondary point, that you chose to ignore, is that Regis Darne died FABULOUSLY wealthy in the late 1930s. That he made a ton of money off the patent for the monoblock issued to him, is indisputable, also. Pieper was in also-ran in the gun business, by any way of comparison, with Regis Darne.

Pieper started his business in 1859. The business continued until 1958. Along the way he was one of the founders of FN. Henri did not die a poor man in 1898.

I explained to you that I didn't know exactly how they differed, but, Pieper's is illustrated in patent literature with damascus materials, and Darne's is not. I do know Darne applied for, and had his patent renewed, in the 1930s.

There is no mention of damascus in the Pieper patent. Not sure what difference the barrel material makes, they all passed proof. A proof that was accepted in France.

So, to make you happy, today, lets say Pieper patented a monoblock of some sort, that must have differed in some critical way from a monoblock that was later patented by Regis Darne. And, for some reason, a lot more examples, like, say 975,000, of the Darne patent monoblock exist today.

Where is the Darne patent available? By the way, Darne was not the only one with a sliding breech http://www.mot.be/w/1/files/RCB/RCB057001.pdf

Pete

Ted;
It is an "Undisputed Fact" that Henri Pieper received a patent for his one piece breech in 1881, Now that is 21 years earlier than 1902. Patents are granted every day on items which have been previously patented for some change, often very minor & not even necessarily an "Improvement", just something a little different. Pieper's first patent had the bbls inserted from the rear, later he made models with them inserted from the front of the block. I have one of these which almost certainly predates 1900 & the breech piece "IS NOT DAMASCUS", but steel. Whether either or both of them died a pauper or wealthy is immaterial to the discussion, the fact is the innovation of a one piece breech in joining shotgun bbls belongs to Henri Piueper, not Regis Darne. That is all I am saying, not that hard to understand now is it??? As to which I personally like the best, well I like my Halifax better than my Pieper, even though the Halifax doesn't have the mono-block & the Pieper does, but what does that prove. A Big Fat Nothing. Actually I like my Lefevers better than either of them.
I still believe in giving credit where credit is due, & for the Mono-Block that goes to Henri Pieper which is a well known fact & confirmed by I guess about every gun knowledgable person in the world, except of course those who simply blind their eyes to truth that doesn't suit their fancy.

I've seen one photo of the Pieper patent (NOT the one you posted, Pete) and it shows a Damascus gun. That COULD be the difference, maybe not, however.

Material, damascus or steel, makes no difference to the proof house, IF it passes, but, it might make a difference at the patent office when one of the materials is a new one, in a new application, which fluid steel would have been-again, I don't know why there exist two patents for the same thing.

I don't have a number for the Darne patent for "Canons Frettes" of 1902, but, I'll work on it.

The last link you listed doesn't open, but, I am aware there were several sliding breech designs that weren't Darnes, or Darne copies. The Levi 4 round double illustrated in The American Rifleman comes to mind.

Best,
Ted