doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Hopkins and Allen

Found an interesting enough H&A for little enough money and brought it home. Thought I'd share as some like play in the lesser known guns. It is a 12 ga with 30" f&f steel tubes, a 45k serial number. It has the typical Bye patent dates related to the Forehand's and H&A's. I've been lucky enough to see a 'AA' or two, but most are plain as can be. I suppose my question is if these middle grades are fairly common? It's stamped '01' on the flats and the water table and I've seen others stamped the same way without any engraving. Is it safe to assume that this is the grade? Or maybe it was a previously stamped frame that H&A used up? I don't have any good references that would show the engraving. Any info or pictures would be appreciated.



Thanks.

R.R.,
Nice piece. Thanks for showing, but would like to see more.
Just don't see many (if any) of these.
-jim

Great find. Sure don't see many of those.

Forehand -- Forehand evolved from Ethan Allen & Co. From 1865 to 1871 it was E. Allen & Co.; from 1871 to 1890 it was Forehand & Wadsworth; and from 1890 to 1902 Forehand Arms Co. After 1902, guns marked "Forehand or "The Forehand" were made by Hopkins & Allen Arms Co.

The "old model" hammer double was a sidelock gun with double underbolts made in 10- or 12-gauge and with Twist or Damascus barrels from 1880 to 1892.

The "new model" hammer double was a box-frame gun bolted by a large dollshead rib extension, and offered in 12- or 16-gauge and with Twist or Damascus barrels.

The hammerless double was also box frame with bolting by a large dollshead rib extension, and offered in grades 0, 1, 2 and 3, in 12- or 16-gauge with Twist or Damascus barrels.

These box frame guns appear to be built on the M. Bye and E.G. Parry Patent No. 490,065 granted Jan. 17, 1893.

My August 1895 Chas. J. Godfrey catalogue offers the Forehand Arms Co. hammerless No. 0 with Twist barrels, list price $50, for $30; and the No. 1 with Damascus barrels, list price $60, for $35.

I saved a Forehand Arms Co. ad from a January 1896 issue of "The Sportsmans Review and Bicycle News" that shows a very elaborate gun and offers ejector and non-ejector hammerless double guns. I also saved a similar ad from the September 1896 issue of "The Amateur Sportsman". I have never seen one of these guns with ejectors.

Volume 15, Issue 3, of The Shotgun Research Newsletter reproduces a 1902 Hopkins & Allen catalogue of their "Forehand" guns. The top-of-the-line hammerless was the AA Grade with a list price of $100 which was elaborately engraved, stocked and checkered. Other grades of the hammerless gun started from $25 with Twist barrels and $30 with Damascus barrels. The hammer models were list priced at $18 with "decarbonized steel" barrels, $19.50 with Twist barrels and $22.50 with Damascus barrels.

Here are some pictures from a 1908 H&A Catalogue --

The gun is no lightweight at #7-9, but the balance is great. Oddly it only has about 2 5/8" dah with the original wood. Probably too much to carry chasing the birds depicted on the sides, but it would be dandy for a pheasant or waterfowl. Can't wait to dust a clay or two.
I'm not much of a photographer, but here you go Jim. The engraving is the same on both sides.




Thanks Dave. I'm surprised that I've never read much in the DGJ about them. Did I miss it? Now I just have to find a 16 and a 20 that match! Shouldn't take long.

Very cool find