doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Trying to Date this Belgian Muzzleloader

I'm needing some help trying to pin down a decade this muzzleloader was made, what gunmaker specifically made the shotgun, and if worthy an insurance value. What i do know(?) is that it is a pre 1893 belgian 10 ga muzzle loader: that's it. I've attached the pictures i hope helps. (hopefully they work lol)

Sharper pictures of the proof marks would help us help you. Approximate date will be the best, based on when each of the proof mark types started.

i tried several pictures these were the best i could get
the second picture enlarged shows the mark as i see it by naked eye (the picture drawing added from the British Proof Marks). the other marks are no more clear without using a magnifying glass (the v? over JR) the only other mark is just the 98 or 86, that even a couple gun dealers and one appraiser had no idea what it was.

It may be an inspector's mark. Look for a spangled letter, post 1877 or crowned letter, pre-1877. The "83"/"86" is more than likely an assembly number. There looks to be an "8" something on the right breech plug. The number should be on most components. Are those platinum barrel bands?

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

yes there is an "8" on the right that's all the bands i'm not sure, if it was a good thing if they were then i would say no lol spangled letters? although no crown of any kind found anywhere

After bringing the pic into a view, the assembly number is "98" and the 2 letters "J" & "R" may be spangled. There will be an inspector's mark on the tubes. Also there looks to be a "L" about an inch forward of the "JR" on both tubes or it may just be my eyes. I'd guess the "London" somehow indicates the type of pattern welded tubes. If you find any initials you might make some headway on PeteM's site: http://damascus-barrels.com/Belgian_Trade_Marks.html

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

ok taking a closer look now that i have an idea what i'm looking at.
Left side first approx half inch or so up from the breech is the proof mark E over LG over a Star in a cicle with no crown
up from that is the letter v and (?) over the letters JR
up from that is the letters L L
(the letter v ? under a mag glass looks like maybe a roman numeral v? or a v with a backwards E or B it could be a star but it is really difficult to make it out)
the right side on the breech is the number 8
up from that is the number 98 then up from that is a number 1 and from the number 1 to the right just 1/4 inch is the letters TL just up and inbetween the 1 and TL is another letter L

Thanks
Dave

L might be for Leclere or Leclercq, but I don't know when Leon was in business:

http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20belge/artisans%20identifies%20l/a%20leclere%20gb.htm


Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

This gun is very early. It may be a conversion from a flintlock. What is interesting is that it is lacking some proof marks that should be present on a later gun. I do show an "L" trade mark, but the maker is unknown ( the registration has never been found) .

http://damascus-barrels.com/Belgian_Trade_Marks.html

Pete

This gun is actually very late. Backaction locks will date it to about after 1835. The style of the finales on the trigger guard and ramrod entry pipe, is after the pineapple and acorn style periods. The trigger guard style of bow, puts it the after 1850 date. As a guess, I would put this gun in the 1855-1880 period. Which is really about the last of the muzzleloader period.