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Forums10
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Jul 28th, 2025
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76 |
Anyone have the action weights with innards of a 20, 16 and 12 gauge Fox (Extractor models)? Working up some idea's on a project and doing my research. PS. Trying to figure out what the starting weights are so I can determine what the finished weights might be if 4 or 5 ounces are shaved off. Thanks
foxes rule
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Joined: Aug 2003
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Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,942 Likes: 19 |
I have a very light 5 1/4 lb. 20 ga Fox and i milled some weight off the inside of the trigger plate. Filling the sides of the frame to remove sterlingworth on sides of a project gun i am building took a good bit of weight off frame .Have no idea how much though.You can round the nose of the frame and forend iron to remove more. Wood density and barrel weight usually contribute most to total weight of gun .On sterlingworth extractor forend you can mill weight off under the long forward tang part.Bobby
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76 |
Thanks. I've got a 3 weight barrel 28" 16 Ga SW with a PG, that comes in at 6 lbs 9 oz. I'm hoping that I can shave off at least 6 oz by action shaping etc., and still have it balance on the hingepin. Gun currently has one of those clunky Fox Forearms vice the nicely shaped (if you will) Philly Forearms.
PS. I've got a 20 gauge just like the above but with 26" barrels and it comes in at 5 lb 15 oz. I shoot it quite well, but was looking for something with a tad longer barrels for better followthru as I have a tendency to stop my swing.
foxes rule
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,551 Likes: 313
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 14,551 Likes: 313 |
Tut, how about skeletonizing the buttstock to see how much weight can be saved? I can't remember the name of the British gunmaker who made many guns of this style. Thomas Turner was probably the best known, but there were others. Another trick is to give up the ribs as is done on a few Boss 20 gauges. It's a project gun, right? If you don't do it, I will. I think the target weight should be just under five pounds.
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,227
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,227 |
IMO, it's the barrels....coupled with the desired balance....that determine what the final weight will be. If you're not going to alter the original barrel weight, there's only so much you do elswhere. You can start with a 4 lb barreled action and make a stock out of styrofoam if you want. You can make the weight anything you want, but that doesn't mean it's going to handle well.
Also, IMO, a smallbore Fox that balances on the hinge pin is going to be pretty muzzle light.
What do your barrels weigh? I have a normally configured Philly 16ga with unmarked 28" barrels that weigh 46 ounces. The complete gun weighs 6 lbs 2 ounces with a 1" rubber recoil pad and it still balances 1/4" ahead of the pin. I've no doubt it left the factory at 6 lbs even & fairly muzzle heavy.
Based on that, I'd say if your barrels weigh 47 ounces, you could build it to 6 lbs effortlessly. For each ounce of barrel weight deviation, add/subtract another ounce in the butt.
So, very roughly,
45 oz barrels ~ 5# 14oz
48 oz barrels ~ 6# 2oz
49 oz barrels ~ 6# 4oz
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76 |
Tut, how about skeletonizing the buttstock to see how much weight can be saved? I can't remember the name of the British gunmaker who made many guns of this style. Thomas Turner was probably the best known, but there were others. Another trick is to give up the ribs as is done on a few Boss 20 gauges. It's a project gun, right? If you don't do it, I will. I think the target weight should be just under five pounds. Bill, Do you mean just under 6 lbs? I think the big issue may be the barrel weight, but I'll talk to PGS about what we can do to the ribs to cut down some weight. If they could take the matting off the top like on the Abby Gun, they should be able to go deeper and take off even more weight. Also, they should be able to skeletonize the receiver (ala like Parker did to cut weight) on the watertable. Perhaps also shave some weight off the forearm iron. Really want this thing at circa 6 lbs if at all possible because it will be carried a lot for sure. They will no doubt have to hollow out the buttstock, this is a pretty dense stick of English I've got set aside for this one. It will really give Dan something to shoot for.
foxes rule
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76 |
IMO, it's the barrels....coupled with the desired balance....that determine what the final weight will be. If you're not going to alter the original barrel weight, there's only so much you do elswhere. You can start with a 4 lb barreled action and make a stock out of styrofoam if you want. You can make the weight anything you want, but that doesn't mean it's going to handle well.
Also, IMO, a smallbore Fox that balances on the hinge pin is going to be pretty muzzle light.
What do your barrels weigh? I have a normally configured Philly 16ga with unmarked 28" barrels that weigh 46 ounces. The complete gun weighs 6 lbs 2 ounces with a 1" rubber recoil pad and it still balances 1/4" ahead of the pin. I've no doubt it left the factory at 6 lbs even & fairly muzzle heavy.
Based on that, I'd say if your barrels weigh 47 ounces, you could build it to 6 lbs effortlessly. For each ounce of barrel weight deviation, add/subtract another ounce in the butt.
So, very roughly,
45 oz barrels ~ 5# 14oz
48 oz barrels ~ 6# 2oz
49 oz barrels ~ 6# 4oz Must be heavier then normal barrels Mike. They come in at 51 oz. Interesting in that I've got a 30" 16, and those barrels come in at 53 oz. This one might be hard to get to 6 lbs without some clever manipulation to the forearm.
foxes rule
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Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,227
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 1,227 |
[ So, very roughly,
45 oz barrels ~ 5# 14oz
48 oz barrels ~ 6# 2oz
49 oz barrels ~ 6# 4oz Must be heavier then normal barrels Mike. They come in at 51 oz. [/quote] Well there ya go. My formula would predict your gun would weigh 6# 8oz. My 30" Utica barrels weigh 51.5 oz. It has a semi-beavertail and to get the handling I want, it weighs 6# 10 oz.
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Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,666 Likes: 76 |
[ So, very roughly,
45 oz barrels ~ 5# 14oz
48 oz barrels ~ 6# 2oz
49 oz barrels ~ 6# 4oz Must be heavier then normal barrels Mike. They come in at 51 oz. Well there ya go. My formula would predict your gun would weigh 6# 8oz. My 30" Utica barrels weigh 51.5 oz. It has a semi-beavertail and to get the handling I want, it weighs 6# 10 oz. [/quote] Might have to go to plan B, which is working over a 20 gauge SW with 26" tubes. It tips the scales at 5 lbs 15 oz currently but is balanced well. This is to be a Grouse/Woodcock gun and I need it to be very portable as they say. I'll say it will be carried a whole lot more then its shot. That said, I'll see what the guys in PGS say. FWIW, they started with a 7 lb 5 oz Sterlingworth and turned it into a finished product of 6 lbs 12 oz and its just a tad muzzleheavy (which I like).
foxes rule
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,942 Likes: 19
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,942 Likes: 19 |
You could have barrels overbored if walls are thick enough and also cut long forcing cones.
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