Ok, it's time to weigh in. I'm someone who hunts Ruff's 98% of the time spent afield. I use 9's and can honestly say that I have enjoyed a 40+ bird /.300+ average over the last 20 years. I have had way too many 1 pellet hits bring down a bird to ever think about using anything bigger. If you're a Grouse hunter you know what a non-lethal hit looks like, you always follow up, and you use a dog. If you're not a dog person (preferably a Springer) you'd be better off hunting turkeys w/ 3.5" mags stuffed with triple B. Man, I hope it quits raining, only 3 more Saturdays left.