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A friend is building a custom .22 rf on a Winder action. He has been told that they cannot be case colored because they have more modern steel than other 1885 'chesters. I say BS! I'd be really interested to hear what some the rest of you think. Joe, I'm thinking you probably know more about this than most.

Just got back from WY after killing three antelope with an original Ballard Pacific. They still work like they used to.

Brent.

Ron Long used to say, "If it was originally case colored, re-do it. If it was originally blued, re-blue it."
I've always followed that advise because Ron Long knows more about Winchester singles shots than anyone I've ever known. He thought there was a change in the metalurgy after the case color era which was pretty darn early.

Congrats on the pronghorn, how about some pix?

Hello Brent,

Is there a metallurgy Dept at your University? If so then a few scrapings or metal filings from under the action tang or other hidden place can be examined and a determination made as to the carbon content of the steel, that should tell you if the action can be case coloured or not.

Having the analysis done commercially could prove expensive though. Just a thought.

Harry

This winder hasn't self destructed yet.

Brad Hurt

Yes, there were several changes in metallurgy.

Yes, IMO the Winders can be case-colored with no problems, as can all the original walls. FWIW one of my smithng mentors built a Winder low wall in Hornet 60 years ago, it's still case-colored and his son is still shooting it. Gunsmith Jerry Kelley of Nebraska has been building BPCRS rifles on Winder low walls for many years and several of them are case-colored.

These Winder low walls have the flared sides of the earlier low wall receivers while at the same time having the large thread shank and thick lower tang of the high walls. Thus it's easy to fit orphan tangs, triggers and barrels from high walls, giving more versatility, and the round unscalloped receiver ring is, IMO, much more attractive. The coil-spring-action lever tension spring is a PITA during reassembly and I personally don't prefer or even use it but otherwise the late coil-spring actions are splendid.
Regards, Joe

Thanks for the comments guys. My own custom .22 is, I believe, a Winder (flare side, thick tang, large shank but no extra holes). It colored nicely. I like the heavier action a lot better than the thin-tang, flat-side low wall. Joe, can you tell me what an unscalloped receiver ring is? Do you mean the trough at the top that allows a lower sight picture?

Harry, we do have all sorts of metals research and engineering around here plus the Ames lab, but a person can't walk in and ask for an analysis in a research lab generally. Time and money are in short supply like never before, but generally it would be like dropping by a law school and asking for an opinion on one's property abstract or mortgage papers.

Steve, here are a few pictures that prove the old Ballard still has what it takes. The last photo is my Boone and Crocket doe

Yep, you got it! After examining your rifle a few years ago I believe your holes were welded closed and a good job it was too.
Regards, Joe

If there were welded holes, they were very well done indeed. I have another action like it w/o holes and it is not yet refurbished. Or at least, if it was it later was neglected so much that it looks like the average original low wall with bad skin. After coloring, most welds are pretty hard to see anyway.

Brent

I have a Winder receiver in the shop that I got from Froggie, complete with welded holes and other welds, that also looks like it hasn't been touched in about 99 years. Look on the inside of the receiver, some smiths weld both ends of the holes but most don't.

AFAIK all Winder low walls had large threads, round unscalloped rings and holes in the side for the Lyman receiver sight. Of course all Winder low walls were coil spring actions.

I have enough parts to assemble a wall action if anyone is interested. If you don't want an action then how about selling or trading me your wall parts?
Regards, Joe

Nice job Brent, and open sights no less!
What cartridge?
That doe will score at least 2 6/8 BC, eh?
Backstraps in the fry pan.

Anyone notice how the gray area on Brad's action perfectly follows the breech block mortice? I wonder who hardened that one?