doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Gun Safe in unheated garage?

A friend kept a large jeweler's safe, (known in the trade as a money safe) outside under a carport roof for several months, including winter. It was full of guns in soft cases (not common knowledge in his neighborhood). He didn't open the door for long periods of time, but it wouldn't have made much difference since the indoor temperature was the same as outdoor temperature. When he moved everything, all was fine. Just don't move the guns back and forth between different temperature levels without giving them time to settle down. A common gun safe is not a money safe, but I think the result will be the same.

It's not the absolute temps that will cause problems, but rather, the differential between the metal and the ambient air temps. If the metal is kept even slightly (1 degreee is theoretically enough) warmer than the ambient temp, no moisture will condense from the air onto the metal surfaces. If the metal surface is cooler than the ambient air, you will get condensation and rust. A GoldenRod is adequate to maintain that differential in a normally sized safe, and is more reliable than a light bulb, because light bulbs burn out when you least expect it. Those who cautioned about bringing cold guns into a warm house are correct. You might also consider insulating the outside of your safe with a fiberglass blanket (a big water heater blanket can be used). If you don't open the safe often, this will minimize the chances of temperature swings inside the safe. You could also run a strip of thin weatherstripping (EPDM) around the inside lip of the door to minimize air infiltration and heat loss from the inside of the safe.

Seems to me that you will be most at risk when you heat the garage with the wood stove. The guns in the safe will warm up much more slowly than the air in the garage, and that will create condensation risk until the metal temp equals or exceeds the air temp. You could put a tub of dessicant in the bottom of the safe, but most dessicants work pretty slowly.

Harney,

As Chuck mentioned they sell heating rods that can be used to warm the safe.

My brother-in-law has two safes in his garage and has had no issue with moisture.

I have never asked him how warm in gets in the safe.

RPr

Mike mentioned bringing a gun inside and having moisture collect on it. This is true as I am sure most of you know. But the one thing I was told a long time ago is to NOT put oil on it as soon as you bring it into the house. This won't keep the moisture off. I have always let the gun warm up to room temperature and then after it is warm, then I put the oil on it. If you put oil on it before it warms up, you could get a layer of moisture between the gun and the oil and this could cause rusting also.

RPr- sometimes if you get a chance, ask your brother how he keeps his gun safe warm and how much heat he uses. I am just curious because he is in the neighboring state and since your weather is so close to ours, I wonder how he does this without any moisture problems. (Or does he have a heated garage?) Thanks.

You don't need to keep your safe warm. You just need to keep it marginally warmer than the ambient air. If the garage temp is 0 deg F, you just need to have the guns at 1 deg F to prevent condensation. If you have wide temp swings in the garage, then you might want to keep the safe a bit warmer so that the guns don't have to catch up to the air temps as the garage warms.

I don't believe this to be true, DD. Warm air can be damp, too. I have my guns in a safe in the basement with a Goldenrod and I had leather holsters in the bottom of it for a while. I noticed after a time that the holsters were getting moldy. A gun safe should be kept with the temperature around 60* and one needs to watch the humidity also. If you have a gun in a damp area and you store the guns upside down, standing on the carpet, in the bottom of the safe, the Goldenrod's heat won't get to the bottom of the safe, so the ends of the barrels can rust too because they can pull moisture from the carpeting. If you are going to store them upside down, I think it would be better to put the barrels on a piece of wood if the safe has any dampness. I started hanging my Goldenrod as low in the safe as possible. But if a safe is outside in the garage where the weather is down around freezing all the time I don't see how a Goldenrod is going to keep the safe warm enough. If it gets hot in the summer, like mine does (up around 100*) the inside of the safe will be hot too and that can damage them also.

A 'Golden Rod' functions by heating the air inside the safe slightly thus reducing relative humidity.

Condensation is caused by the temperature of an object being cooler enough than the surrounding air to cool air in contact with the object to below it's dew point. The dewpoint rises or falls with relative humidity.

That's all there is to it. Obviously, the more stable is the temperture and humidity in the room containing the safe, the better.

I have kept most of my guns in an unheated pole barn shop with a concrete floor inside a large antique Mosler (I think that's the name) safe for several years now. It is a big safe, weighs about 5000 lbs. I'm told, and has walls and double doors about 10" thick. I drilled through the floor when it was given to me and ran the cord inside for a Goldenrod. I have seen the outside of the safe literally dripping water off it from condensation, but upon opening the doors the contents are always warm and dry with never any hint of condensation or rust. The Goldenrod is an amazing little piece of work, and the post by Ducky's Dad helps me understand the effectiveness of it. I wouldn't worry about the temps, and I can't imagine you could have humidity as high as I do down heah'. We joke that if you don't like the weather just wait a few minutes and it will change.

Like others have suggested, I'd watch the contents closely for a few months just to make sure your equipment is all working as it should, but I don't think you'll have any problem.

Stan

I am not sure the golden rod really does reduce the humidity,as it only raises the temp inside by a degree at the most.
I gather it works by raising the dewpiont of the metal as mentioned above.
Regardless,I have a dehumidifyer in the basement and keep the whole lot at around 50%.
It remains cool year round.
My understanding is large sudden swings in both temp and RH are the things to avoid for both timber and metal.
I also have a small extractor fan on a timer to slowly turn over the air in the room,mold will not grow if there is air movement I am told,although it probably wouldnt below 60%RH anyway.