doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Classic & Custom Single Barreled Sporting Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Charcoal bluing question

Has anyone tried charcoal bluing? If so would you please share how you do it? There seems to be very little written on the subject.

I have not done it but did see this,

http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=918.0

I tried the above URL several times, only to get a 403 message Access Forbidden.

Do you have to be a member of that site to access it?

Harry

Shawn,
an email heading your way.

Do you have to be a member of that site to access it?

Harry

No, can anyone else access it?

I am a member and I can access it. Some of the forums on that site can be seen by nonmember and some cannot - at least I THINK that is how it works.

Cheers BrentD,

I thought that may be the case, now I'll have to find a way of accessing the site so I can join up. As if I don't have enough problems already. lol.

Harry

I think this is everything from that site:

Charcoal bluing (12L14)
by Wayne T McKay LSU Tiger
I've been asked to describe charcoal bluing, so here it is, no holds barred.
Prep for the barrel is really easy. First, have the lugs installed and sight dovetails cut, sights fitted, and vent drilled (liner, if used installed too). While I'm sure some try for a near mirror finish, that's not needed for this finish. Starting with a sharp, large mill file, draw file the barrel. Softer steels, like 12L14 will tend to clog the file and make "pins" which will make a deep scar in the surface. I make it a point to clean the file every two or three passes. After doing the top five flats, you can switch to a smooth cut file, but I usually stop here. The trick is to have a smooth, even finish on the barrel. If the rear sight is steel, polish it to match the barrel and install it in it's dovetail.
To handle the barrel from this point on, I attach a wire to the front barrel lug and run it to the recoil lug of the breech plug with about a foot of slack in it. Before starting the fire, degrease the barrel. I start with the bore, since I usually put a good coat of "RIG" grease in it after coning the muzzle to prevent rust. Here in Louisiana, that's a must! Denatured alcohol, from a hardware store, works great and after the bore is clean, degrease the exterior of the barrel. From this point until it's finished do not touch the barrel with bare hands! The oil in your skin will be enough to discolor the finish. That's reason #1 for the wire.
The charcoal that I use is for the "Big Green Egg" smoker. Brand isn't important, but the fact that it must be pure charcoal is. "Kingsford" and "Royal Oak" are great for cooking, but the briquets contain slag, binders, and other lovelies that could make your project a mess. Just make sure the bag is labeled "pure hardwood charcoal." You can dig a pit for charcoal bluing or use a box. My box is five feet long and six inches by six inches. The material is 1/4" steel. Fill the box (or pit... you could charcoal blue in a ditch) with charcoal and get a good fire going. You can use what ever means you choose to light the fire. I use plain lighter fluid. You should have glowing coals from one end to the other not here and there. A floor stand oscillating fan helps here.
When you have a good fire going, rake the coals to settle them and knock off the ash. Place the barrel in the coals (reason #2 for the wire) and cover it with hot coals, but add fresh charcoal to almost fill the box. Watch the fire to make sure you didn't smother it. Don't pack the coals, just let them settle naturally. The point is to keep oxygen away from the steel. Exposed steel will turn black! If every thing's going smooth, let the barrel cook for about three hours, adding fresh charcoal as needed. Some instructions call for removing the barrel every few minutes (!) to rub it down with powdered lime. I've never done that and don't see the point of pulling the barrel out of the fire to expose it to oxygen and plunge it back into the fire for a few minutes.
After three hours, remove the barrel with the wire (reason #3) and hang it to cool. except for dusting off the ash, leave it alone for three days to allow the scale to harden. Gently heat the barrel with a heat gun and apply paste wax (the type for wood floors) to seal the finish and buff. You're done!
As a final note, the color ranges from a deep, midnight blue to purple. Purple indicated that the temperature got a bit too hot in that spot. I have no idea as to how to control that! The pictures show my box with a 42" barrel to give you an idea of scale.
Wayne T. McKay

LSU Tiger:
Durability? Pretty good, but make sure the tang is inlet well to avoid bending it when you tighten the screw, or it will crack the bluing.

LSU Tiger
The only way you can pack the bore is to crush the charcoal into small pieces and pour it into the bore. The Schultz company makes charcoal for use in flower beds thats pretty small, but you can only get a 2 (?) pound bag. It's also moist, which may effect the outcome.
Wayne T. McKay

To fill the bore you just crush up charcoal, pour it down the bore and tamp it in. It does not prevent the bore from bluing but it does stop it from slagging . Slag is thick oxide that makes the bore rough. The charcoal I use is no larger than a pea in size. Smaller sized charcoal gives a more even color and reduces mottling or dark spots. Figure on a 20# sack per barrel, but the left over in the box can be reused if you smother it out.

Box Construction.
From Jerrywh
You might also add that the best way to charcoal blue with the least charcoal is to put the barrel in a plain black iron pipe packed with charcoal and with a cap on each end. Leave the caps loose pack the charcoal in small pea sized pieces. It is much esier and cheaper to get a piece of iron pipe than it is to have a box made with a lid. Also the temperature doesn't have to be over 800 deg. fer.
I put mine in an electric oven that I made myself but it doesn;t matter how you heat it as long as the heat is fairlly even. A large wood fire is as good as anything. I made a 48" long electric oven. the inside of the box is
6"x 6"

From LSU
I have three 3/8" holes spaced 18" apart in the sides of the box right off of the bottom to allow rain water to drain out. You could plug them with a bolt stuck into the hole, but I don't. I added them because that thing is heavy empty, but half full of water... GEEZ!
All I do to the bore is make certain it's oil and grease free. After a few shots (50 or so), the bluing is worn off of the bore. Wal-Mart would have the charcoal, but only during spring and summer. I get mine from a grill and patio specialty store year round. It costs a bit more, but I get a 40 pound sack.
Wayne T. McKay





Engraving:
What,if any, effect does the charcoal bluing have on engraving?
None whatever. My name is engraved on the barrel and looks fine.
Wayne T. McKay


Bluing and Precious metal inlay:
If you want to charcoal blue a barrel with gold inlay, what do you have to pay special attention to?
Suppose you get the barrel too hot? Will the gold melt?
Do you engrave the gold after it's been through bluing -or- before?

Chris Immel:
A LOT of European (particularly Spanish and French) barrels are charcoal blued with gold and silver "damascening" (metal inlay), and I've always wondered how it was done. I'll ASSUME that the charcoal pit isn't hot enough to affect the gold/silver....
jerrywh:
In charcoal it is not the charcoal that blues the gun barrel, The only thing the charcoal does is keep excess oxygen away from the metal so as to stop it from slagging. If you want even color of blue it is important to have good clean charcoal.
Good clean pure wood charcoal will do real well. Impurities or dirt or oil of any kind will cause a mottled appearance or a change in the color. It is a whole lot better to spend $3.00 more for good charcoal than to do it over again. Fill the bore also.
It also will be more even colored if the charcoal is fine grained rather than big chunks. The heat should be fairly even from one end to the other. The idea of rubbing with lime was started by someone who confused the process of heat bluing of swords and gun barrels in Europe with charcoal blueing. Rubbing with lime may have been done before the barrel was put into the charcoal as a de greasing process but they were never taken out and re rubbed during the charcoal bluing process.
The heat bluing of swords and gun barrels was a totally different process.
The normal heat of charcoal bluing will not phase silver or gold inlays. Silver and gold inlays will stand up to 1500 deg fer. with no damage. [1525 deg fer. will not only melt them out but they will alloy with the barrel steel.] The longer they are held at 1525 or more the deeper they will alloy. Don't bother to look up the melting point of gold because it does not apply when it is alloyed with carbon.

http://americanlongrifles.org/forum/index.php?topic=918.0

I was able to access it.

Will that process draw the temper out of steel parts, or isn't that a concern? I can see where a barrel could warp if the heat wasn't consistently applied over it's length. Is that a concern also? How durable is this finish compared to, say, a rust blued surface?