doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Fixed chokes were made to open?

Gentlemen:

I was reading your opinions about to open or not open fixed chokes in a good quality shotgun.
Some time ago I read in this forum that shotguns were made with full chokes in both barrels so the owner could open them whatever his needs.
I have a Merkel model 124 made in the 1920�s that have 0.040" chokes in both barrels. I do not touch the shotgun chokes because you said to me that is a valuable piece, but I really want to know if the "theory" that those shotguns were made with full chokes on purpose so the owner open them as he wish.
If that theory is true, then to open the chokes in a valuabe old shotgun does not decrease their value a bit.

I hope someone could afirm or reject the "full choke on purpose" theory with some documentation.

Best,

Back in the good old days, whenever you think that was, folks wanted guns that were "hard hitting." Everyone knows that a gun bored C/IC is not a hard hitter.

Seriously, I can think of three reasons why guns were bought F/F, with no intention of them ever getting openned up.
1) In the good old days they bought into that "hard hitting" s.., er stuff.
2) Before the advent of plastic wrapped shot columns (ca. 1960), full wasn't as full as it is today.
3) Much of the landscape in the first half of the twentieth century was deforested. Aside from the grouse woods in the northeast and the quail shooting in the south, there weren't so many opportunities for close shots.

IMO it has long been accepted that modern shot shells reduce the need for tighter chokes because of the way shot is protected in a modern wad. That said, I still appeciate a gun with some choke. The ideal set-up has probably moved from MOD/FULL to IC/ IMP MOD.

I depends.

A best game gun was made and choked as the man who ordered it specified. His needs and preferences were what dictated the chokes, as they did all other options.

Off the shelf guns were intended to be selected and used as they stood and were tools intended for a variety of uses. A lot of British cheap boxlocks were made I.C and Full because it gave the option of a close range or a long range shot - either extreme.

I find guns easier to sell with some choke in them as that is what most customers want - but many ask for them to a be altered to suit them. It does not affect the price of the gun, just its desirability to some people.

They also shot a lot of game that was not flying.

I couldn't agree more. When a lot of these full/full guns were made market hunting was still legal and was an accepted way of earning a living. Shooting sitting game with close chokes was very effective and precise aiming was possible with such chokes thereby allowing for head shots which damaged less meat and rendered game shot in this manner more desirable and commanded higher demand/prices.

Since virtually every maker offered guns with various choices of choke boring, it would be silly to say guns were purposely sold full and full just so customers could alter them to suit their purpose. Sounds like a fallacious argument dreamt up by the hone 'em out school. Even if all of a gunmakers' customers were gunsmiths who had the proper equipment to do this, why would they bother when they could buy it choked as they wanted it for the same cost without the additional work.

Exactly, Keith.
Mike

In all probability these guns were MANUFACTURED with full choke and then sold in bulk to a retailer who engraved or had engraved their retail name on the barrels.
It would have been more economical to produce guns without options and to get the retailer or customer to pay extra to have choke work done at a later selling point.

Oh come on, that just doesn't make any sense. Full choke double guns were made for market hunters to shoot game sitting. *rolls eyes*

Market hunting was a profession but very few people actually did it. If every old full choke shotgun had been used by a market hunter then there would be absolutely no game left today because it would have been wiped from the face of the earth.

Full choke guns were the fashion of the day, it's just that simple. It continued well into more modern times. Just think how few open choke Model 12 pumps or Browning A5 automatics you see. They're all 28 and 30 full just like most of the old doubles.