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Forums10
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Mar 28th, 2026
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 101
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 101 |
Here is my little H&H "Shot and Regulated by Holland & Holland" marked Webley & Scott. It has been a fine gun in the grouse coverts.  "Thank you for your email. We do provide a historical research service for a charge of 30.00 but having checked our records on your shotgun, the record is in fact blank and so would be unable to provide you with any further information. However I can confirm that your gun was finished in 1967. Your shotgun was one of a number of Boxlock Ejector's that Holland & Holland commissioned to be built through the Birmingham gun trade as it was cheaper to produce and thus cheaper to retail. When the guns were nearing completion they were sent to the Holland & Holland factory for final test shooting, regulating and finishing. Therefore since they were not true Holland & Holland shotguns built entirely at the factory we engraved "H&H" on the sideplates and not the full "Holland & Holland" name and the model name; "Shot & Regulated" engraved on the barrels. As mentioned these were made through the Birmingham gun trade with a large number, as you correctly pointed out, being made by Webley & Scott and coincidentally your gun was actually made at the Webley & Scott factory. I hope this helps. Best regards, Andrew Ambrose For Holland & Holland "
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 326 Likes: 23
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 326 Likes: 23 |
very nice boxlock,a 700?
cheers
bill
NA
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 101
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 101 |
I'm not sure what Holland & Holland called this model but it is the same gun as the W&S 700.
Last edited by Slowpokebill; 03/19/11 02:36 PM.
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,574 Likes: 168
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 11,574 Likes: 168 |
H&H eventually purchased Scott, but that was not until the mid-80's. After that, a couple boxlocks called the Cavalier and the Northwood were made at the old Scott factory. But they were fancier guns than the one shown above. I've heard ones like that referred to simply as "shot and regulated" guns. Certainly looks like a 700.
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 12
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,164 Likes: 12 |
Pete,A great post! In the mid 1970,s I was privileged to spend best part of a week in the W.&C.Scott,works on Tame Road, Birmingham.At that time Scotts were introducing C.N.C. machining into their manufacturing process,I think that this was a first in the British sporting gun trade. I understand that the machine tools employed were eventually transfered to H&H London and became the starting point for the implementation of C.N.C. machining at Hollands.
At the time of my visit, Scott,s were making guns for others.Seen in progress were guns for H&H and believe it or not, boxlocks for Canada,s much maligned, Frank E Malin!
According to P.G.Whatley,Managing director,Scotts biggest challenge at that time was to obtain London prices for Birmingham made guns!
Their guns named,Blenheim,Chatsworth,Bowood & Kinmont were intoduced in sequence and named after the location of the Country Landowners Game fairs[C.L.A.].Even this marketing effort did not bring them significant improvement in sales.
Turning to Webley and Scott 700 series, Mr Martin is correct in his grading.For example, a 1961 price list in my collection, gives the following pices for 12G guns;
Model,700 55 pounds
Model 702,72 pounds,
ModeL 701 92 pounds.
The model 701 is identifiable by its profuse scroll engraving contained in panels on the action body and a fore end that incorporates shoulders at The junction with the fore end metal[ A feature found on some best boxlock English guns]. This model also came standard with a Gold oval and drop points on the stock.If you would like copies of the price list and related catalogues please send me a P.M.
Last edited by Roy Hebbes; 03/22/11 11:05 AM.
Roy Hebbes
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,598 |
Roy,
You always have some of the best stories. London prices for Birmingham, eh? With that business plan the results are not surprising.
Pete
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 367 Likes: 25
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 367 Likes: 25 |
Can anyone tell me a way to post pictures on this site?I'm having a hell of a time with it. I try to copy and paste and it won't work. Thanks, Marcus
Last edited by sandlapper; 03/20/11 02:33 PM.
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Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 367 Likes: 25
Sidelock
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OP
Sidelock
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 367 Likes: 25 |
Thanks,I'll give it a try. Marcus
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,548 Likes: 112
Sidelock
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Sidelock
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,548 Likes: 112 |
Do you know I might be confused about the points on the 702,its a long time ago. I will be speaking to a ex Webley stocker next week so I will ask him.
I don't know whether all 702's had drop points, but the Crawford and Whatley book on Scotts shows a photo of one (p. 72) with drop points. The 712/720/728's, which were basically 702's made for the American market and with the last 2 digits designating the gauge, did have drop points. (I owned a 720, which also had factory 3" chambers--and weighed about 5 3/4 pounds. Needless to say, I never tried any 3" shells in it!)[/quote]
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