doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com CSMC rocks

I wish his Fox prices were a LOT lower! Until, and if I can afford one I'll be very satisfied to use my RBL 16. If I ever run across one of the "light" 12's I'd have to raise the debt limit!

Chief

I agree with Tanky, CSMC Rocks. I like the agreeable nature of doing business with them. I have one of there RBL 28ga. doubles, and am more then pleased with the 3 f's fit, finish & function. I shoot it A lot on the Skeet field, and have been bird hunting with it. Haven't had any problems, but am pleased to know that it I do, I can expect A good outcome.

Nice looking junk.

Friends:
As someone who has recently received my Parker repro 28-bore barrels, and interacted with CSMC about them, I can only say that CSMC does indeed ROCK!

They have provided me exceptional service and courtesy. I can only applaud them.

And... I wish to specifically thank Carol T. in the CSMC front office. She is such a delight to deal with, and such an fantastic problem solver that Tony G. should promote her to VP of Customer Relations without delay!

Here's to everyone at CSMC... Cheers!

I think what may be at the root of most complaints is a lack of consistency on CSMC's part. The problem is, like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're going to get. Folks just don't know what to think about them. Are they a world class high end firearms maker? If they are you'd tend to give them some leeway on delivery times and things of that nature, hey bespoke guns take time right? However you would give them no leeway at all on quality issues, after all they took all the time they needed right?

I don't suggest that this is the norm, but I was on a high dollar pheasant hunt with some folks and one fellow had his brand new Galazan Fox with him, it was gorgeous, no doubt. However the top lever broke off in his hand in the locker room on day one, and he had to use his backup for the rest of the trip. He handled it far better than I would have. I don't know how much he paid for it but I think it's fair to say it was a 20K gun at the least. A fluke? Maybe but it doesn't inspire confidence.

I had an RBL, it wasn't a bad gun, I moved it along because it just felt too fat in the wrist for me. That's personal preference and no fault of CSMC. I had some minor problems with it and never really got the assisted open to work, but I didn't really keep it long enough for a real proper break in.

I forgive any problems associated with the initial RBL launch, after all something like that hadn't been done before, there's plenty of kinks to work out. However what annoyed me was that as they kept introducing guns they were always way behind on their time estimates. I refuse to believe at that stage of the game you couldn't have given people good answers about delivery times.

I talked to Lou at the Vintagers when they were taking orders for the 28 gauge RBL. He told my buddy some ridiculous time frame for delivery that I know couldn't be accurate because they hadn't even caught up on their current RBL orders. That to me smacks of deception to secure deposits and nothing else. I didn't want to cause a scene so I let it slide knowing that my buddy wasn't going to order one anyway.

Seeing pictures of some of the first A10's coming in showed more of the same. They first one I saw pics of was stunning, phenomenal wood, fit & finish. The next one was of an A10 with a finish so bad it look like they let it dry in the box on the way to the customer. The next one with a gap in the forend you could stick your pinky in. How does that happen?

Did they fix the above problems? I don't know I'm sure they probably did. Is that the point? No, we're not talking about a busted spring or firing pin, we're talking about basic quality control. I very much get the sense that if they push three guns out that aren't quite up to par and only one comes back they're ahead of the curve.

I don't question their capability to make outstanding firearms, I question their commitment to doing it right the first time.

About 8 years ago I sent my post-war 16 ga. M-21 to CSMC for stock alterations and rebluing. I worked with a guy named Todd, and had a really bad experience. After multiple returns to fix something newly messed up from each previous time they had it, I ended up sending it to Andy W., who did a very nice job making the gun right. That's old news ... I was really unhappy but it didn't stop me from looking at the RBL. I cancelled an order for a 20 because of nervousness over their inconsistent startup qualty, but eventually ordered a 16.

I REALLY like it, very nice 2X wood, fine wood to metal fit, and I got lucky to get one with virtually no drop between comb nose and heel. I didn't ask for this, asked to have it bent and it was already where I like it. I sent the gun back to correct a very sticky bolt, and to ask if they could replace the forend with one that better matched the buttstock. Adam gave me a great new forend, and they replaced the bolt. Really nice service.

Unfortunately, the new bolt and their lavish application of grease to the bites didn't fix the stickiness. It always catches a bit, and often sticks so tight that it hurts my thumb to break it free -- especially when the action's been closed for a while. The thumb bruising is from the toplever flange being very small.

Here's what Adam replied when I told him.
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From: Connecticut Shotgun [mailto:galazan@msn.com]
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2010 9:01 AM
To: Gramith, Jay (Legal)
Subject: RE: Attn. Adam - followup on RBL 16 returned for service

Dear Jay:

It usually takes 200 hundred or so rounds for the locking to be broken in. It needs the recoil to set the bolt. It can be filed in but this takes years off of the locking that is not good for the gun. Give it a little time and then let me know how it feels.

Adam
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I don't shoot clays except for pre-hunting season practice, and still don't have 200 rounds through this gun. The sticking can be really annoying, but hasn't been too bad when I'm shooting, so I'm waiting it out. Does anyone have an informed opinion about what I should do?

But ... the reason I wrote all this: if the bolt were to get sticky on my 21, I'd just back the bolt set screw out about a quarter turn - problem solved.

Jay

Jay, why don't you just go out and shoot some clays, you could shoot up the 200 rounds in an afternoon.

Lots of things competing for my time ... eventually I'll get there. Meanwhile, if anyone has experienced a sticking bolt get better with wear, I'd be encouraged to hear it. I confess to being a little skeptical.

Jay,

If you take the barrels off and work the top lever does the bolt stick? I ask that since they have changed the bolt and it did not remedy your problem.

Chief

It's definitely the bolt sticking in the bites Chief. After the gun has been closed for a while it sometimes becomes very tightly stuck.