doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com W.R. Pape

Greetings:
I recently came into possession of a W.R. Pape shotgun, watertable marking 1974 and hope that you can tell me something about this beautiful gun, history etc. as I plan to clean & restore it soon. It is not Damascus, so would you recommend normal loads or a particular grain & shot?
Thank you,
Bryan Langlois
360-441-0002

Bryan

If the "watertable marking 1974" were the serial number then the gun would date from circa 1872 and would almost certainly have damascus barrels.

What is the number on the tang back of the trigger guard?

Greetings Doug:
I'll be back home on the 31st and will check all this guns markings, but it is not damascus.
thank you,
Bryan

Hello Bryan.
The following may be of interest.
1831 - William Rochester Pape was born in Amble, a coastal fishing village in Northumberland, England.

1858 - W.R.Pape wins the Field Trials.

1859 - W.R.Pape wins the Field Trials.

1859 - W.R.Pape organises the first dog show in Great Britain and the prizes are Pape shotguns.

1866 - W.R.Pape wins the Field Trials.

1866 - Invented choke boring in Shotguns (British Patent No. 1501) There are other claimants such as W.W. Greener (an ex apprentice of Pape) of London and Birmingham and Fred Kimble the American shooter, but Pape is generally recognised as the original claimant.

1867 - W.R.Pape provisionally patents a system of mechanically retracting firing pins (#594[p] 2/3/1867). Later in the same year Pape improves upon this system (#2488 3/9/1867). This patent also includes a description of an extractor.

1870 - W.R.Pape patents yet another improvement of mechanically retracting firing pins (#752 15/3/1870).

1875 - W.R.Pape wins a prize of ten guineas awarded to "the original inventor" of choke boring. The prize is the idea of a Mr. Lane, and is awarded to settle a dispute taking place in the correspondence column of "The Field" newspaper over the origins of choke boring. THE FIELD organises a trial to compare the merits of the new choke bored guns over the traditional cylinder bores. Pape finishes 2nd and 3rd in class 1 for choke borded guns and 1st in class 2 for cylinders (Pape has entered three guns in his own name and three in the name of Davison of Morpeth). The trials leave no doubt as to the superior patterns and penetration of choke bored guns.

1887 - W.R.Pape wins a prize medal at the royal mining engineering and industrial exhibition.

1889 - W.R.Pape retires, leaving the business to his son, Victor.

1889 - W.R.Pape guns win a diploma of merit at the Glasgow exhibition.

1902 - W.R.Pape moves his business from 29 Collingwood St. and 36 Westgate Rd. to 21 Collingwood St. Newcastle upon Tyne, England

1923 - W.R.Pape dies following a road accident.

1935 - W.R.Pape business was bought and name-changed to Bagnall & Kirkwood (Late of W.R.Pape).

1944 - Sidney Guthrie was employed by Mr. Kirkwood as a junior assistant.

1954 - Mr. Kirkwood died and Mr. Guthrie took over the business.

1969 - Bagnall & Kirkwood moved to 52 Grey Street, following redevelopement of the original Westgate Road address.

1973 - Mr. Guthrie's wife Mrs. E. Guthrie joined the business and became joint owner.

1981 - Mr and Mrs Guthrie's son Alan joined the business.

1993 - Sidney Guthrie died in April of this year and his widow moved the business to 28 Grey Street in October of this year.

Bagnal & Kirkwood do not manufacture firearms and have not done so since the mid 1920's, today they are just a retail outlet for supplying Shooters and Fishermen.

Pape's Shotguns and Rifles had an excellent reputation although they never as fancy as those of some of the London Gunmakers, they were structurally and mechanically their equal. Many local shooters still swear by them, rather than at them. The guns made were suited to the client, and a try gun was used to acertain the correct fit for the individual customer. As with most gunmakers, Pape produced a ranger of qualities from the 'Cheap and cheerful' to a grade that was the equivelent anything produced by the 'Famous Names'. However, as a regional gunsmith his main customers were not the wealthy, but the average shooter and of course Gamekeepers.

If your Pape is in good order, with an unpitted barrel and a tight action I would say use it by all means, BUT, stick to Black Powder loads, That will certainly mean handloading, but it is worth it. If your not sure, get a qualified gunsmith to check it out.

Harry

What is the checkering pattern like�Pape�s are often rather �fancy�?

Berrien Moore

PLease discribe the gun and give its number > By "water table" do you mean the action flats?

No, I would not recommend 'normal' loads for this shotgun. I wouldn't recommend anything for this shotgun until you tell us what you have there. A picture or two sure would help.

You think it's been blued over ?

Douglas Tate did a good article about Pape in Shooting Gazette.
Gloss over it as much as you like, but both Pape & Greener were rogues.

Bryan, Happy Birthday !!
Thanks for your post
As you can see, much interest
Looking forward to the pictures on the opening day of Dove Season