doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Belgium Shotgun Pair - Info Help (Pic Heavy)

I am trying to find more info about a Belgium pair of shotguns? It has Belgium proof marks. It has no makers name. Can some one help me identify the maker of this pair. No 1 gun has Nitro proof written on the barrel in addition to the markings on No 2

It is a side plated boxlock, ejectors, 30" barrels and 16 ga.






















Any help is appreciated,
Thanks

Some additional pics....

Pigeon guns maybe, given the "Monaco" on the rib and the bird on the trigger guard. 2 1/2" chambers, date code looks like 1928.
Can't help with a maker's name. Are you sure they're sideplated boxlocks? If so, they've gone to the trouble of showing a lot of false pins--but then so does V. Bernardelli, in its Roma series guns.

Great pictures of the proofmarks
You will find this helpful

http://www.shotguns.se/html/belgium.html

interesting reading here

http://www.thefirearmsforum.com/showthread.php?t=38174

It was proofed in 1928.
http://damascus-barrels.com/Belgian_All_Proofmarks.html

Andrew Jno. Hy. & Co. Ltd. Toledo steel works, Sheffield England, may be the source of the barrels.

Pete

Looking at pics this way and another, this could be a sideplated boxlock indeed, what with the action face being closer to triggers than on most sidelocks, and two screws on the trigger plate. But the lock plates are beautifully executed, it's hard to believe it's not a sidelock!

I had doubts about 16 ga as a pidgeon gun, but then I remembered seeing a Belgian 16 ga side-by-side with the word "Skeet" and images of broken clay birds engraved on the action. It had short barrels choked cylinder or IC, consistent with the routine on early skeet guns, and it looked and felt the part in every way except 16 bore. There might be something about the use of 16s for clay and live bird shooting in Belgium.

From the images, almost a zero chance of it being a sideplated boxlock. It is a bar action sidelock; count the which of what pins and pegs you fancy. It has the Purdey nose and side frame reinforcement but no sideclips. Interesting Sheffield Steel Works stamp. I do not think the tubes were sourced from England, but an ingot or bar stock may have been imported and the tubes made in Liege.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

Names of Pigeon rings were advertised or used as models?









Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse

There are side clips and I also believe that it is a sideplated boxlock with fake pins. Some of them even have gearing that move the fake tumbler pivot.
16Ga 2.5" chambering makes for a very unlikely pigeon gun.
Best regards,
WC-

Indeed, it does have sideclips. But I am just taken aback that all the pins would be faked? I guess the absence of the retaining screw on the right lock hints to a sideplated? I'd like to see the lockwork. Hum, sure not what it seems on the surface. I guess if a retailer would scrub off the marks, they would also fake the pins. Also the initials near the forend hanger look to be overstamped. If it is as stated, it needs to be added to the pin/peg thread.

Kind Regards,

Raimey
rse