doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Another “Who-Done-It” ! (OT Rifle)

Terry,

Well you and I have handled both 1 & 3, I would someday like to play with 2 maybe if I go to Reno next year the owner will bring it along.

A good idea, I’ve been working my through both Dutcher (Ballard) and Hamilton & Rowe (American percussion Schuetzen) looking for clues.

I am comfortable saying that the same person did all the work on all three guns. Somewhere someone took an interest in him and published an article or pictures of his work. He would have had to make a lot of guns to achieve the level we see in these three rifles. This post is with the hopes that some engraver or wood carver can at least recognize who his teacher was.

The carving reminds me of a Kennedy shotgun that I own. Minneapolis is not so far from Chicago to think that a Kennedy workman could not have built these. Or at the least, did the carving.
Kennedy Bros were both builders of shotguns and sellers of others work.
Just a thought.
Best,
John

John,

Do you have pictures that I could look at? I think I have a Kennedy catalog somewhere and remember an article in Gun Report, I'll look it up. There is a little thing about the scrolls in both the wood and metal, they have a little circle or punch mark in the center on the end, something I have not seen before.

Thanks, MP

PS: I just read the October, 1996 Gun Report Article on Kennedy Shotguns by Jeffery Tordoff. No carved stocks on the guns illustrated, could you post or send me some pictures?, Thanks.

I just got off the phone with Jeffrey Tordoff who, at the time he wrote the article on Kennedys was the curator of firearms for the Minnesota Historical Society. He has never seen a carved Kennedy firearm or one that he believed was engraved locally. I am VERY interested in learning more about your Kennedy gun.

Does anyone else have a carved Kennedy Shotgun?

I'll give you a couple of my thoughts on #2...

I think the initials on #2 are I.I.J. in monogram form with the last name initial larger and in the center. Just a stylized form of lettering done to both balance the letters out and add some flair to them.

I wonder about the lack of any engraving on the recvr also, but if not a N/S receiver, then either it had to be annealed to be cut or in the very least, the case hardening 'skin' polished off in those areas to be cut. Perhaps too much extra work for the maker/engraver and he left it plain. The scroll engraving looks to be on the less than 'master engraver' side of the scale.
The more I look at it, it almost looks to me like a plain rifle that was built perhaps pre WW2 because of the stock style and then had some mods done to it in the 50s or 60s from the looks of the carving, checkering and engraving styles. Another explanation for the plain parkerized recvr may be an upgrade through DCM for a free high number receiver to replace the old low# one at some point. A service that they used to offer to NRA members I believe. Just my thoughts! Thanks for posting all the pics. Love those '03 sporters..

Michael, my friend.
I will try my best to take a good picture of the gun. Problem is that the carving is so worn that I hardly think it will be viewable.
One point to make after taking the gun out for the first time in a few years.
The forend is the wood that has the most work. The butt chevkering is moderately elaborate with a bit of carving.
The patterns are still able to be seen and would serve as a pattern for restoration.
Let me see what I can do with this new digital.
Best,
John

Michael, The buttstock architecture of the #1 gun has absolutely captivated me. Regardless of your search, you will see this influence in my future work.
And so the traditions will continue. Whenever I am looking for something new, I look towards history.
Thanks!
I guess you don't have this gun to photograph? I'd love a true, straight-on profile view.

Steven,

These three rifles have about driven me over the edge. I cannot believe that this quality of rifle was made by someone who is not well know or was well known. If you remember back to the to American Rifleman article you wrote about a fellow Montana gunsmith, call him up (he is in Tulsa this weekend) and go visit and photograph No1 ;-).

No.1 at the bottom, with a pocket camera at Vegas.

IMO the key to finding this person is in the fact that he did the stocking, carving and engraving. Also the ends of the scrolls have a punch mark or hole found in both the wood and metal. This is something that I have rarely seen before.

MP, whose display of custom rifles was that you pictured from the Vegas show?