doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Victor Sarasqueta Model 4E 16 Gauge

Howdy Folks;

I'm brand new to the forum and have finally made the move I fear will be the start of a sickness that is sure to turn my wallet into a black hole. I was once a serious skeet junky, traveling around the western united states competing (zone 7 if memory serves). Then about 5 years ago, after a long break, got the sporting clays bug and finally treated myself to the K80 I have lusted after for years. All the while I was happily enjoying my competition over unders there was a fascination of the classic double gun growing and the desire for the upland hunt. I managed to fight it off for years, but alas have buckled after watching this little 16 gauge VS model 4E sit in one of the local shops for the last year. It's a solid functional gun, but certainly not the cleanest example for sure. If what I believe to be the date code is in fact the date code, it's a 1952. This is my first double, but I'm sure not my last.

Anyway, I have a couple of questions. I know I have paid too much for it, but the owner had no interest in dealing and was certainly willing to wait to sell it for what he wanted and the gun was just calling me. So I'm in it $825 and I know there really isn't any collector value in these so I'm curious if I should spend any money having it cleaned up or possibly re-chocked. It's full/modified if memory serves me right. It's still in jail waiting the 10 days CA wants to make sure I'm not the next serial killer, so I only have photos of the stampings and don't know much about reading them anyway. The second question is regarding the loads I should be using. I'm a huge B&P fan and was thinking about their F2 Classic shell, but am not sure if that is a proper load for a gun of this age. Any other info those of you who know these well can share would be much appreciated. I have photos I would love to include but the site doesn't allow images to be directly inserted. I'm happy to email them to anyone that can provide me any info.

Thanks very much

GC, welcome to the sickness! I doubt you overpaid for your gun. You can go to the For Sale forum and look at a very fancy VS gun that's listed. Yours isn't at that level, but most of the VS guns we see Stateside were imported by Stoeger back in the 50's and 60's. Solid guns, but even more basic than yours.

Choke work isn't terribly expensive. M/F is probably tighter than you need for most upland hunting purposes, so have it opened however you want. Plus, with more open chokes and your skeet/SC shooting experience, you can take your sxs to the club from time to time and wow the target gun guys with how well one of those outmoded guns can perform.

Nothing post-WWII is really old. If your gun is relatively light, you won't want to shoot a lot of fast, heavy loads through it, simply because you won't like the recoil. But a few of them, if you're hunting pheasants for example, won't be any problem. If you want to email me your photos, I can probably tell you more from the proofmarks on the barrel flats and water table: ljoelbrown@gmail.com. Always enjoy looking at nice old sxs.

Welcome!

The BP 16 ga loads should be just fine for your gun - they are loaded to CIP standards.

I would suggest patterning it or shooting it a while before messing with the chokes. They may have been opened already, anyway.

I don't know what you mean about having it cleaned up but you could refinish the stock yourself (good winter project) and really have a beauty. The VSs are great guns.

Thanks guys, I really appreciate the feedback. I wish I could post the photos for you. LB, I will email them to you in full resolution so you have the best shot at reading the stampings. It will take multiple emails to get them to you. Thanks a bunch for offering to look at it for me.

Pretty sure the chokes haven't been messed with as the guy at the shop used a gauge to tell me what the chokes were, although it was not a gauge that measures the choke in relation to the bore behind the choke.

The one thing that bugs me most from a finish standpoint is one small spot (less than 1/8" in diameter) of rust in the bluing on the left barrel.

The model 4 is a little plain Jane. Well, maybe it's a lot plain Jane. But I'm a sucker for a 16 gauge and I'd have paid more than $825 for it :-)

If it's a 1952 gun it's not likely to be a light game gun - most likely a medium game gun. Pics would be super in figuring out what it is (kyrieellis@aol.com). How much does the gun weigh, total?

On the chokes, that's M/F in the day of fiber wads and no shot cups to mention so it will probably shoot more like IM/XF. You might consider have it cut for choke tubes (Briley does a great job).

Congratulations on a nice gun.

Just for fun, here are some pictures of a Stoeger Sterlingworth's (Victor Sarasqueta Model 4), also in 16 gauge. This particular gun was made as a live pigeon gun. It's an eight and a half pound 16 gauge!









I had this gun cut for choke tubes by Colonial Arms and have shot a lot of trap and skeet with it. It's a fun gun to shoot.

Thanks for posting the photos. I know mine is a Model 4 as that is engraved on it but the engraving on the fences on mine is significantly more ornate. Did the engraving vary a lot on these? I was thinking about having it cut for choke tubes by Briley but thought I might get booted from the forum for suggesting such a thing.

Spanish shotgun are all hand built, individual, guns. No two are exactly the same. And as for having Briley cut it for tubes I'd say "Do it." Hell, I've got Briley on speed-dial :-)

Thanks. Seems like it would make it one heck of a versatile upland gun.

The Zephyr 4E was marketed in that designation until 1958 when Stoeger changed the designation to the Zephyr Uplander. The Uplander sold for $144 in its introductory year.