doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com When to restore and or modify?

I am a believer in "Restore."
The British have their guns refurbished every few years by qualified gunsmiths, while Americans say "Don't TOUCH it!"
Well, for those who wish to do that, I say fine. It's your gun.
However, if I had a wonderful older side by side that needed fixing to be shootable, I would do it.
They were made for shooting, not just to hang over a fireplace.
One cannot "buy another barrel" at reasonable price for an old Parker or Fox. But, there are those of us who think the good old American Standard of "Full and Rifle Full" are just too much in this age of much better shot shells.
I will probably be chastised for this inexact quote, but a great English Shooter of legend was once asked how his gun was choked and he replied "Full and Full, Sir." Upon his death, someone measured the gun, only to find it was choked cylinder/cylinder.
Open the chokes if you wish.....with my only proviso to be use a damn good gunsmith, not some shade tree butcher.
Sam Ogle, Lincoln, NE

Is it a sin to make a gun more versatile? Not in my book. How much does an alteration lower value depends on what is done to the gun. Good rule of thumb might be to evaluate the gun. Is it a rare gun or rare combo of features, high condition or mint, unfired, NIB or some other unique reason that this gun above all others has special value? A model 37, while nice, mostly likely does not have enough special reasons to be so unique that alterations will vastly destroy value or function unless it is about top few percent in condition or a rare version. One of the million plain field guns certainly is a candidate for alterations.

If not, alter as needed but use some amount of respect of what ought to be done. No proporting barrels, no adjustable combs or morgan pads, no chrome plating or high polishing of all the case colors, no slathering trueoil on like a prostitute at a MaryKay convention, no adding vent ribs to a double, no decals added to stocks or barrels, no glow worm beads or sights and no camo paint or tape for anything nicer than a Nitro Special and not even then if a high condition gun.

As mentioned, many guns in North America are well used examples. I personally would rather have such a gun PROPERLY restored as opposed to hunting with a gun that looks like crap or you have to carry an oil can around with you so the barrels don't rust while out hunting. And if it's an English gun I would be even more prone to having it restored as the English didn't/don't frown upon keeping a gun in pristine condition.

Only in America do you have the "Cult of the Original". Machine-made guns seem to be more highly valued if they are kept as factory-original as possible. English guns and other hand-made guns, are usually bespoke to begin with, so there is really no standard configeration to adhere to. Also, after a season of hard shooting "across the pond", many guns are completely stripped down and refurbished in anticipation of yet another year of hard use in a very wet climate. One could argue that a 100-year old classic English double has been "restored" as many as 90-times over it's lifetime of service. For these types of guns, condition is far-more important than originality.

I have just under 20 SxS, all acquired in the last 10 years or so. There are only three that that I wouldn't modify, none that I wouldn't "maintain" in the English sense.

As Gunsaholic just said, I rather spend my time afield with something that I love the way it looks, so I have zero issues with ensuring all aspects of the gun are well maintained. That is separate from modifying the gun (a permanent change)

The three I won't modify are an extremely high condition Tolley, a unique and high grade Ideal, which CJO is currently "maintaining" and my previously restored great grandfather's Fox A grade.

But having said that, the more I learn about my guns, the less inclined I am to want to modify them. I usually like them as they were originally made.

It also matters if you are a "collector" or a "user". Guns range on a scale of quality and value from being "art" to "funtional-art" to "interesting" and then finally as a "tool". IMHO-If a gun has given many years of good sevice to someone near-and-dear to you, then by all means keep it as a memory of that person, as little changed as possible. If, however, you mean to use this device to harvest game as efficiently as possible, then make it suit your purposes. If that means opening a choke or altering the stock, then so be it.

one of my best customers has convinced his wife that all of his guns are valuable collectibles and the best long term investment he knows about...in order to justify additions to his collection, he has also convinced her that it would devalue his guns significantly if they were to be altered in any way...so, when none of his treasures fit a need, she realizes that there is no other option, but for him to go out and acquire another valuable firearm collectible for their long term investment portfolio...in her mind, there is no such thing as one gun for all situations. one must have many...by the way, she has a sister who is recently widowed, with a long term investment firearms portfolio as a dowry.

I'm not sure "one of Ed's best customers" and "long term investment firearms portfolio" really go together.

I've looked at lots of your ads over the years Ed, and forgetting all the issues that get raised here about the quality of restoration work that may have been done, even a relative newbie like me knows you aren't in the investment grade collectible business. At least not with shotguns.

Everyone pays more for more original condition and less for less of it - the Brits included.

That's just how it goes.

Personally, I would never restore/refinish a gun, and I would never buy one that has been restored/refinished.

OWD

I had a couple redone and couldn't be happier with them.

To each his own.

These guns were both with broken stocks and poor metal finishes when I got them.

The first one is a 3E 20g Ithaca NID with a factory SST and ejectors. I even had it modified from the original configuration (gasp!). It was a pistol grip splinter and now it's hacked up and a worthless straight grip beavertail. I'm sure it's completely ruined. I'll just have to keep it forever.

The second is a 12g AE Fox that is now trashed with a non-standard round knob grip instead of the highly valued plastic cap and the non-standard tart wood and X grade checkering and Schnabel insert have assured nobody would want this gun.

I guess I made a mess of these two. What was I thinkin? I guess I shoulda just bought RBLs.