doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Buying a top tier English gun with new barrels

I'd make life easier, by saying a man buys the best English Sle gun he can. I'd also take the collector tag out of the picture - not quite like collecting Lefevers in their different grades and conditions.
...but then, who knows that many rich buyers of top English guns eh?
I rate 'em all as shooters, as they are the best in the world at what they do - and I'd rate them as excellent, good and fair - and that would be that!
A newly barreled Boss, by Boss wouldn't cause me to lose sleep either.

LG - you speak well for your point of view. However, there are differing points of view and some people with the money to back up their point of view. Why would collecting fine Brit guns be different than collecting fine American guns? When studied carefully, Brit guns are not "monolithic;" Each purdey is not exactly like every other one. Yes, they are shooters, but not everynoe has interest in shooting. Some are much more interested in the history or the craftsmanship or the artestry of Brit fine guns. Three pigeon holes of condition rating is not sufficient due to the high prices commanded by the current market. Saying "fair" is worth $10,000 to $20,000, "good" is $20,000 to $30,000, and "excelent" is $30,000 to $40,000 just does not divide them finely enough. Most people are not satisfied to get the gun priced "to within $10,000 or so."

Newly barreled anything is not an issue for me. Establishing market price is, because we are all pretty sure the market does discount this work by some amount.

Thorny,
If you have a Boss with a spanking new set of T. Wild barrels what you have is an opportunity.

I wouldn't speak exactly as to what you had until I'd seen you shoot it. If I have said this once to you, I have said it a thousand times-the proof is in the pudding.

Rocketman knows exactly where to put me in his catagories, above. I shoot stuff with a gun. If I take the Boss/T. Wild combination gun to the gun range and run 50 straight, what I have, is a gun.

Anything else, is icing on the cake.

The tires comparison is a bit misleading, really.

Best,
Ted

PS I don't own any gun wax.

Ted is a "Shooter" - pure and simple. He values the gun for how it performs in his hands.

The couple of chaps that I know who shoot some of London's best, only revel in the fact, that they have the best the world has to offer.
When you reach that certain station in life - you just have!
They'd be horrified to think someone actually collected these great guns.

LG - sit your friends down, provide each with a healthy dose of asperin, red wine (sweet, I believe --- could I recommend St. James Velvet Red), and a healping of the blood pressure med of choice. Now, as gently as possible (for we all know you are gifted a golden tounge), explain to them that there are very likely more of these fine guns squirreled away in private "museum" collections and hard asset investment portifolios than there are ones out there doin' what they are supposed to do.

I have an Army and Navy SLE 12 bore with new barrels by Benjamin Wild of Birmingham. To what extent is the value of the gun decreased by not having the original barrels?
Mike

The short answer is that we would have to know the condition of the original barrels and what prompted their replacement.

This is sort of an apples to oranges question. If the object is to compare to a similar gun which has the original barrels, then the Wild tubes on your A&N may or may not shave something off the comparative value of your gun. If the new barrels compare favorably in every way to the originals, the gun is in proof, etc. then little value is likely lost for this particular gun. The equation changes depending on the name on the gun, its overall condition and the quality of the new barrels of course.

Well, the quality of the new barrels is excellent, as one would suspect, by Wild. The gun balances right on the hinge pin, shoots where it looks. And throws beautiful patterns from its half and threequarter chokes. I had an English gun which has sleeved barrels, thick walls, ruined the feel of the gun, and did not shoot to point of aim at all. Absolutely ghastly, as my granddad would say.
Mike

You will rarely, if ever know why the barrels were replaced.

Reeasons: worn out, damaged (anything from run-over by a tractor, blown or bulged by blockage or wrong ammo to left damp and uncleaned until eaten up by pitting and rust), steel made to replace original damascuse, vice versa, long barrels made to replace short or vice versa (more likely), an extra set made and the originals subsequently lost etc etc. The best you can do is guess unless the maker has some record of the reason (unlikely).

Inspect the whole gun carefully, or get someone to do it for you. Current condition, including the new barrels is what you are dealing with now.

With lower priced guns I think it makes little difference to the price. For example a £700 Lancaster boxlock with replacement barrels by Lancaster wouldn't make more if the barrels were original, especially if they have lost some thickness over the years - which is pretty much a given.

With entry-level 'best guns, if anything , the value will rise slightly with new maker's barrels because most people buying sidelocks and boxlocks under £8,000 want to shoot them.

Once you get to the £15,000+ mark, people get more fussy about originality AS WELL AS CONDITION - nobody wants the original barrels if they are worn out but in this bracket, you will get a vv good best sle with sound original barrels anyway.

Once you get into the higher end - say £20,000+ you will find newer guns with original everything and older guns with replacement everything. For example - I have a Kell engraved vintage Purdey on the way to me that was re-barrelled by Purdey in 2001 and re-stocked with exhibition grade wood by a Purdey stocker the same year, totally refurbished and cased with all accessories. It cost the owner £17,000 to do the work. The asking price now is in the region of £20,000. Compare it to the cost of a new Purdey - £60,000+ and it looks like a damned good deal.