doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Stock dimensions on old American shotguns.

Why do so many old American shotguns have so much drop? And the length of pull is, on the average, much shorter than the guns of today?
I don't see many foreign guns with these dimensions.
Why would they choose guns like this, and did the better shooters of years ago have similar guns?
Pete

Pete, most shooters back in the late 1880s or so were smaller men hense shorter pull. They also shot with a different stance than most do today. The head up position was very popular back then.

A different take on this I heard recently from an older gent who began hunting with low stock guns. He told me a common way to sight on game years ago was to cover it with the barrels, not to see it above the plane as most of us want to do today. Thus, the low stock dimensions allowed the gun to shoot flat or even a bit low when it was held tightly to the cheek. He said that the advent of skeet shooting gradually influenced US shooters and gun makers responded with higher stock dimensions. Silvers

As funny as this sounds, I have heard that what they wore had a bearing. During the late 1800's and early 1900's it was common for men to wear starched collars and ties, even when afield, particularly the more "gentrified" the gentleman. With such a stiff, high collar comfort demanded a head up position.

Just to add some perspective, here are standard stock dimensions for popular doubles, from the 1940 Shooters Bible:

Parker: 14 x 1 5/8 x 2 1/2 (LOP of 13 1/2 to 14 1/2, drop of 2 to 3 1/4 available at no charge)
Fox Model B: Length and drop "about" 14 x 2 3/4
Sterlingworth Skeet and Upland Game: 14 x 2 5/8
Stevens 530: 14 x 2 3/4
Marlin 90 OU: "about" 14 x 1 5/8 x 2 1/4
Iver Johnson Skeeter: 14 1/8 x 2 3/4
Hunter Special: 14 x 2 3/4
Winchester 21: 14 x 1 9/16 x 2 1/2 for 12ga; slightly higher for 16 and 20
Winchester 24: 14 x 1 1/2 x 2 1/4
Savage 420/430 OU: 14 x 2 3/4
Remington 32 OU: 14 x 1 5/8 x 2 1/2
Browning Superposed: 14 1/8 x 1 5/8 x 2 1/2

Almost all shorter than current guns; many with more drop.

They didn't know any better.

Their cheek bones were down near their mandibular joint?...nah, probably not :-)

It's possible this 'upright head position' idea may be a myth. Look through the early 1900s posters, calendars, and die cuts shown in Classic Hunting Collectibles by Hal Boggess, esp. the Trap shooters on p. 47 and p. 80. To my eye, they all have their cheek firmly placed on the stock with their neck extended far forward; or 'crawling the stock.' A pinback on p. 208 shows a trap shooting lady and it look like her nose is actually touching her right hand. I had a 1928 Ithaca catalog with pics of champion trap shooters and every one, at least in the pics, had that same head and neck position, much different from the upright head position favored by trap shooters today and made possible by long LOP and adjustable Monte Carlo combs. On p. 76 is an actual photograph of men shooting skeet with very similar gun mounts.

Wing shooting in 1906 by the postmark




Trap shooting. BTW: In 1931, A.J. Stauber shot 1087 singles targets before missing using a LC SBT and in 1934, Frank Troeh broke 845 of 850 doubles targets in a 3 day shoot. "Crawling the stock" must have worked for them!

Neck extended forward, head scrunched down on the stock, eye looking straight down the rib