doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion Double Rifles, Paradox Guns & Gauge Rifles @ doublegunshop.com Help on August Francotte 30-06 double rifle

I recently acquired (my first)double rifle. It is an August Francotte 30-06 with 25" ejector barrels weighing 8 1/4 lbs and has a claw detachable 1-4x scope with the 3 post reticle. Made in 1928. Would anyone know what loading this gun may have been regulated for? There are no markings to that effect on the barrels that I can see. I'm considering trying the Federal Fusion Lite; 170gr. semi pointed BT @ 2,000 fps. to start with. I will take this gun deer/hog hunting this fall. Also, if any of the members could estimate what the gun is worth, I would appreciate it. And, what is the purpose of the rib protusion between the muzzles? I have attached several pics; in one, it is next to a pre-war Sauer 12 ga. for comparison.

Gary,
That protrusion is the wedge that was used to regulate the barrels.They are usually cut off and finished flush,but I had one left long in case I have to have it re-regulated. Your rifle was likely regulated with European ammo and you may have to try different loads.This is where handloading comes in handy.I would start with 180 gr bullets.If they shoot wide,they need a little less speed;if they cross, they need a little more speed.
Mike

I would use something like this

http://www.midwayusa.com/Product/216718/...point-box-of-20

OK, Gary, NOW I'm jealous! That is one gorgeous rifle! Condition seems great. What're you wiling to trade for? Incidentally, nice Sauer shotgun--guess you stole it too from an old man.....

I just felt sorry for the guy with the Sauer....he obviously needed to get rid of a gun so he could acquire another damascus hammer gun made during the reign of Queen Victoria. Trade the Francotte? Hell, I haven't shot anything with it yet....it has to go to Whittington next year and needs to shoot a deer and some hogs. It was made to shoot, not sit in the darkness of a collector's vault.

Ok, OK, been over a MONTH, how about an update

Lovely gun. Probably not much eye-relief with that old scope. Don't get a black eye shooting it.

Neat gun I'd like to know what they go for. I'd like a 30 .06 or .308 sxs

B. Nickel scopes are excellent (I own a couple). It doesn't seem to be mounted too far back (as some European scopes can be) so I don't see any problem there. A nice and practical outfit!

With kind regards,
Jani

Jani, that is lovely, how is it to shoot recoil wise, not too bad I bet.
Sweet Gun...I am A Francophile,:)
Franc

Last couple double rifles I examined were .30-40 Kraig by LeForgeron and Birmingham made .303 English with highly regarded Scottish name on the barrels (can't remember the name either Henry or Frazer). Neither had means of scope mounting. The former was $9,000 and latter $14,000. There are a lot of AF admirers in USA and fact that firm still exists helps a great deal. This was few years ago and not being interested in double rifles I do not know what this would bring in today.
The 60s vintage B Nickel is still usable scope. There are plenty of old German Weatherby scopes still in use. I had 2,5x fixed power B Nickel from mid 70s on my .375H&H (that was when I was foolish enough to buy something so large) and the scope was ok though much, much worse than something like 1,75-5x Vortex Diamondback.

With respect to loads I would think you need to reduce average gas pressure of the standard modern .30-06 cartridge by about 40-50MPa. If you don't reload using reduced recoil (lower velocity) loads may accomplish this. I don't know.

How are those Nickel scopes? I was looking at 1,5-6x42mm with L1 illuminated reticle for my .300H&H. Does it have good illumination adjustment so that brightness can be adjusted for shooting at dawn and dusk? I little concerned that in lower light situations that arrow might be too much illumination. I love that reticle design, but don't want to blow away 2,189+ euro to find out. Thanks.

Update on the Francotte........
The two pics show 2 rights and 2 lefts at 100 yds. using the Federal Fusion Lite (170 gr. @ 2,000fps)load which is about 30-30 power; barrels open easily and ejection is strong. This is as close as I could get it to shoot without spending many hours reloading and shooting as I have been unable to bribe Skeetx into applying his loading bench magic. This will do for the range I'll use the gun this fall; shots at 100 yds. or less. For sure, this Francotte does NOT like regular power 30-06 ammo. Standard velocity 150 and 180 gr. loads crossfired with hard to open barrels and sticky ejection. I'm still thinking it was regulated with 220 gr. bullets at about 2200fps.
Jagermeister, the Nickel scope is an old one (the gun was made in 1927)but is exceptionally clear with positive adjustments and and adjustable eyepiece that allows you to focus to extreme sharpness. Anyway, it will be fun to take hunting a couple of times before it probably gets sold or traded for some Winchester 21's.

YUP, that Skeettx is a rascal
Oh yes, what did you say was your name

Good luck on the hoofed animal hunt

I have been spending my time dove hunting and wishing
about duck season

Mike

GaryW,
With Double Rifles, improper bench technique can cause targets that make it seem that the rifle dosen't shoot as well as it really will. Try normal 180 gr loads and this time hold the rifle in both hands, raise the front rest so you have to sit upright,and fire the right barrel followed by the left as quickly as you can get back on target.Let the barrels cool to ambient temp. barore shooting the next right/left.When you shoot a cool barrel next to a warm one the target looks bad.
Mike

I sat upright and rested the fore arm/barrels in my right hand for this session. I did not fire quickly on the second barrel, but will try that next time. Rear trigger is MUCH heavier pull than the front trigger, and I understand that is to prevent sear slippage and doubling. Front trigger is extremely light. I still believe the gun was regulated for 220 gr. bullets and will get around to trying those. For this season, those Fed. fusion lites will get the job done. If that 1st shot continues to plunk the heart/lung area, there will be no need for a quick second shot.

GaryW,
It's possible that it was regulated with 220gr, as you believe.If you have confidence in the way it shoots, it doesn't matter what anyone else thinks.
Mike

Unless you have tried already I would take scope off and test the gun again. Quite surprisingly one can sometimes get very good results.

Hello,
that rifle could be chambered for the .30-03 round which has the 220 grs bullet but also a longer neck than the .30-06.
You should do a chamber cast to make sure of the exact chambering...
Lovely rifle...
WC-