doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Trigger finger freeze

Flinching = Your body telling your brain to tell the trigger finger, "don't be stupid". I believe that if you wack your thumb with a hammer often enough, the same condition will occur, the distraction happens when the body goes in revolt and tells the brain, "I'm waiting for the pain"!

I shoot sporting regularly and have for 7-8 years. About three years ago I came down with this precise affliction. Like a cold-solder connection, as Jim described it. It got so bad that I would flinch 7-8 times per round (100 birds). I blamed it on the trigger first, then pre-mounting, then other things. Never really figured out why it started or how to stop it. A few months ago I received Bill McGuire's new video, Focus and Fire. I know Bill well and was eager to watch it. I so identified with the style of shooting sporting clays that he teaches that I immediately put it into practice. My scores have gone up dramatically, won my class at the QU shoot last month, and now for the kicker............ my flinch is gone!! It was exactly what jakeroo described. Too much gun movement in tracking the bird. Now, I insert the gun on line at a predetermined point along it's trajectory and look back for the bird, tracking it with my eyes while it approaches my muzzle. Then, just before it gets to my muzzle I pull out front with a very, very short move and shoot. I think it was the anticipation of the shot that caused the lock-up. Not anticipation of recoil in my case, as I actually went from 1 oz. loads to 1 1/8 oz. at the same time I tried the new method.

I sympathize with anyone who suffers with this malady, and it truly is suffering to a serious shooter. Never flinched on a live bird in my life, only clay ones, and never pulled the trigger on a flinch. Hope this helps someone. Stan

I have periodically experienced a flinch which involves not pulling the trigger coupled with a bucking forward into the anticipated recoil. I come away feeling the safety was on - which it wasn't. Only happens on one gun, a 12 ga, and usually only after a few rounds of skeet. Hasn't occurred with sporting clays, even when using that same gun. So I figure the problem is psycologically linked to skeet with 12ga - an unnecessary past time I have replaced by shooting 20ga. I think I built this problem by quite a few years and 10s of thousands of rounds with that gun shooting 1 1/8oz skeet loads, without hearing protection (before anyone was concerned about such things) and without a recoil pad. One of these days I will put a recoil pad on that gun just to see what happens thereafter.

Another cause for what seems like a flinch in clay targets, particularly on the second bird in doubles (as was mentioned in the original post) is that they shooter just took their eye off of the bird (hunting for the second bird with the barrel) or head off of the gun. When the picture does not look right, the brain will not let the body react.

This may sound odd, but ask you friend to try a few shots with his middle finger on the trigger (the "bird" finger). Don't ask me why, but this sometimes works with a real flinch...uses another neural path in brain or something along those lines. Of course, if shot this way continually the new path may pick up the flinch also.

There are a couple of words that you should never use around me.

"FLINCH" if I'm shooting.
"SHANK" if I'm golfing.

I used to shoot with an older gentleman who suffered from trigger finger freeze. He switched to a release trigger to solve the problem, and it worked for him. The problem seemed to come on with age. This guy has been shooting all his life and the problem only started within the last few years. Shooting clays with a release trigger is no problem since it's a controlled situation, but I would not hunt with one.

It took a while for me to get use to the "click" sound, then hear him call pull, then the shell discharge.

There is also a condition know as "Pulling Wood", this ossurs when the shooter lays thier finger flat along the side of the wood disabling every finger joint except for the tip. Just try immobilising your whole finger ans see how much movement you get from just the tip, you will also note when you do this there is little feeling or strenght. This condition can be overcome by taping a small piece of dowell to the wood so as the main knuckle at the palm rests on it and keeps all finger joints free of the wood. It really works where this condition is the problem.

Hotrack

My flinching has been seen by people three feilds away. Not world class but high AA. Flinching can be caused by both muscle and neuro problems. We all have the odd muscle spasm or twitch and that can cause our trusty trigger finger to go early or even refuse to go at all. The brain can have several different causes. The dread of recoil can cause the brain to cause a flinch, it just hates the recoil that it is about to cause. The second version is when the sight picture just does not look right and the brain refuses to pull the trigger until it looks right. Sometime a cross firing with mixed or off side donmint eye can be the cause.

Cures are just as complex. Identify the cause and the cure often is fairly easy to figure out. I used my middle finger, for my trigger finger for over a year to get past a flinch. I have used sight blinders, dots of tape on glasses, cast off in stocks to reduce face slapping. You name it and it has been tried. One fellow went to shooting left handed to get away from his flinch. One fellow shot .410 only for two or three years because he flinched. Became a real good 410 shooter and had a ton of empties to share. Shame he did not shoot the 28 to get past his problem.

If you start having flinching problems the only thing to do is go back to basics firts. Was the gun mounted well? Was you head down on the stock? Did you see and track the bird as normal? Do you follow through the shot? Has the trigger pull on your gun changed, too light or too hard? Are you crossfiring? Pick it apart, the answers are there.

"Flinch", "yips" in golfers, and a host of other movement disorders are now classified as a 'Task Specific Dystonia'

http://www.wemove.org/dys/dys_flimb.html
http://www.doctorbob.com/06_9_4news20.html
http://www.imakenews.com/wemovenews/e_article000394359.cfm?x=b11,0,w

The problem has ended the careers of some professional golfers and musicians. Aynsley Smith PhD, Director of Sports Pyschology and Sports Medicine Research at the Mayo Clinic, Rochester, has researched the problem extensively http://www.radiology.medscape.com/viewarticle/411176

Michael Keyes, M.D. discussed the 'Yips' on p. 28 of the Sept. 05' Shotguns Sports Magazine

I've previously shared that I've been forced to stop shooting trap. No one is interested in my medical problems, but the explaination is illustrative and complex related to:
1. Otosclerosis-a familial problem causing tinnitus, loss of hearing, and dysequilibrium (dizzyness)
2. Several previous sports and MVA related head injuries causing dysequilibrium (and likely explains some squishy brain behaviour)
3. A familial problem with involuntary myoclonic jerking/fine resting tremor that may be associated with head titubation (involuntary head shaking)
4. Bad osteoarthritis in my neck and back
5. Way too much trap (with a M-12) and sporting clays with 1 1/8 loads

I frequently 'flinch' trying to click the mouse on the computer! And trust me, I've tried every 'cure' short of a release trigger. My point is that a 'flinch' is as real as Parkinsonism and the causes and cure thereof can be terribly complex. Give guys a break when discussing it, because it's unbelievably frustrating to have no control over something as simple as pulling a trigger or swinging a putter, especially when doing that gives us such joy.

I'm gonna weigh in on this one more time. I have dealt with these issues quite a bit over many years.
In addition to the last post, I forgot to mention trigger pulls. Several of you have stated that you have trouble with a flinch or failure to fire on the second trigger. If a trigger pull is too strong, it will cause a flinch.
For me, if the second trigger is over about 4.5 lbs. it is suspect. I have some old doubles with the second trigger in the 7-8 pound range. They will have me practically lurching off the launch pad in one or two rounds. So, if the second trigger is causing a flinch, check the trigger pull.
Second, as I mentioned in my last post, the length of pull can cause a flinch. If you don't believe it, get one of your old doubles with a short stock (We all have some of these, eh?) and go shoot it a few rounds. You will usually end up flinching or lifting your head or both. This may be a problem with the flinch or failure to fire on the second trigger. Traditionally, length of pull on doubles is measured to the front trigger. But, if a stock is just long enough for you to the front trigger, then it is too short to the back one. On a gun with two triggers you should use a LOP that is just a bit longer than your optimum for the front trigger to butt measurement.
Finally, on the issue of release triggers. They are obviously not an option on old doubles unless you are or have some genius gunsmith available. But for modern tournament clays guns which are shot with a mounted gun they can be marvelous. It is a whole physiological thing about releasing rather than pulling. You can find articles about it if you look.
The release triggers are really quite easy to use and master and they WILL have you shooting more smoothly.
Many years ago, when I first experienced a flinch when shooting my tournament Perazzi, I went to a release. I was amazed at how easy and natural it was. I remember telling my dear old mom (God rest her) about it. I was trying to explain why it was a good idea. She stopped me and said: "It makes perfect sense to me. I know when I try to take a picture with a camera I always move the darn thing when I try to push the button. If all I had to do was let go of the button, I don't think I would have that problem." That little old lady could just sense the logic of it.
I am fortunate that I seem to be able to shoot any trigger, release-pull, pull-pull, or double. I think one reason for that is because I went to a release-pull at the first sign of a problem. I didn't wait for it to get bad.
But, if you have an issue with a flinch, try a release on your modern guns. There is a reason that a majority of the very top (especially older) trap shooters use them.
As for the old doubles, get the triggers adjusted to a fairly light crisp pull, make sure the stock is the right length and "slap" it.
Best Regards, Jake