doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Does Bismuth shatter?

Last fall I took a couple of mallards using bismuth shot.

Tonight I'm eating mallard and every few bites I am hitting some hard, crunchy stuff. At first I thought it was bone chips so I just chewed them up. Finally I pulled one out of my mouth and it's a bismuth fragment. I haven't seen lead pellets shatter like this (except on big game using slugs) but it looks as though a couple of pellets shattered into small bits?

These shells were old, probably some of the first from the Bismuth Cartridge Co., maybe 10-15 years ago.

Normal? Anyone had a similar experience? At least no agita tonight.


Thanks, Rob

I've heard about it a number of times, but can't recall actually seeing it myself. There was an article in one of the gun mags within the last 2-3 years about non-toxics, and they talked about the early bismuth shot doing this. Obviously it did the job.

Nick

Rob,I believe the early Bismuth was more brittle and although the current variety is improved but is still more brittle than lead. Because of this they do not recommend pushing it to high velocities and also suggest buffering, which I assume is to reduced
deformation or shattering on ignition.In your case the pellets probably shattered on striking bone. Terry

I've heard about something sort of like this but never experienced it. I use only Bismuth for waterfowl.

Brent

Let me tell you a story. Went out to a NAVHDA function which was taking place on land where non-tox had to be used. There were many newbies there. I was asked to do a demonstration of what a trained dog can do in terms of pointing and retrieving. There were quail out in the field. I happened to have a 10 round box of very early Bismuth 12 bore ammo that I had won in some shoot or other.

I put my beloved master, Maggie, down and we headed out into the field in front of the crowd. Maggie locks up on a nice point. I flush. Up comes the bird – a nice easy 20 yard straight away that you could hit with a slingshot. POW! Ack! The friggin’ bird is still flying!! Pay attention, Greg! I go to the rear trigger – POW! – bird keeps going. No retrieve. Nobody laughs, but that was embarrassing, because I like to think of myself as a decent shot.

Oh well, shaking it off we keep going. Pretty soon another point; another easy shot and two more misses. Chuckles from the peanut gallery now. GGRRR! I must really be losing it.

We keep going, confidence totally shaken this time. Another point, bird and two more empty hulls, no bird. Maggie is now giving me The Look, too.

I give up; figure I’m having the worst shooting day of my life; and ask a friend to gun for me. He’s a superb shot - both targets and wingshooting. Now we’ll be able to redeem ourselves by demonstrating a good retrieve. He takes my gun and the four remaining rounds. Point – flush - POW – POW - no bird once again. I noticed something I could not see when I was shooting. When my buddy fired there was a big puff of odd brown smoke at the muzzle.

Sooo, we set up a cardboard box at about 15 yards and fired the last two rounds at the box. Not one pellet strike! The Bismuth pellets were turning into fine dust from the stress of firing.

Since then, I have burned up my share of bismuth on prairie grouse and phez in places in the west where non-tox is required and have never had this problem again. That said, I don’t have confidence in the stuff and I much prefer TM for upland hunting with non-tox.

No wonder I had so many misses that day last fall..... yeah, that's it... that's the ticket... my ammo was disintegrating!

Say halleluhah brothers, I have been vindicated!

Thanks for info, perhaps I'll get in touch with BCC.

But can you get TM to reload with?? And has the new bismuth shot improved to a point where it doesn't shatter??
All the best

I add 5% tin to my bismuth shot that I make. Not that I make enough to keep any manufacturer up at nights. I read several years ago that pure Bismuth tended to be somewhat brittle and had the potential to shatter but when mixed with another metal that property went away. So just like they add antominy to make lead harder you can add another metal to bismuth to make it less shatter prone. I make absolutely no claims to be a metalurgist or expert in any way but that has worked for me. For all I know there are ten better metals to add to Bismuth.

KY Jon,
Is one of those ten better metals Lead?


treblig 1958,
Yes we can get TM here in the UK for reloading purposes, try a Kent Cartridge vendor.

I have used bismuth for about five years with good results, in fact I just ordered 250 yesterday - Eley Maximum 34g No.4 and my wallet has not yet recovered from the shock.

Early bismuth loads had a reputation for being brittle but I understand that tin is now added at manufacture and this has sorted the problem.