doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Loose forend

You are correct Bill.
I have many shotguns with loose extractor cams. I think most of them came that way. I am not pressing out their pins to tighten them up. I might narrow a slot in a fore end, or flatten/widen a barrel lug, but probably no pin pressing.

A sidelock Miroku is typically a very well made gun. I think I've seen them w/caps and without. If the caps could be removed, you might be able to unscrew the hinge pin and tighten the cam. That's a whole bunch of work for a couple thousandths.

CZ I agree, the Miroku SL is a finely crafted gun. Probably the nicest gun I will have the pleasure to own. Little money and running out of time and motivation to make more! That may add to my desire to perfect it.

This one appears to have caps. One alternative I thought of would be to peen the stop tight,(punch and hammer) smooth out the surfaces, (file) and see what happens. I wouldn't admit to it here though!

Is it possible that there is a screw going from the bottom inside of the hinge pin into the stop? It seems unlikely for a maker to rely on simple interference fitting for a part as frequently stressed as an extractor cam/barrel stop.

I still say the stop should have zero relationship to how the fore end fits. Here is an easy test for you. Take a small piece of paper and fold it over so it is double thickness. Trim it so it fits the recess in the fore arm. Does the fore end go on the gun? If so, how hard was it to put on? Did the wiggle go away it the for end? My suspicion is that even though the lug seems tight it need to put more force upon the fore end pushing it tighter to the breech face.

Peening has its place, just not in most of the situations mentioned in this thread. The problem with peening a mechanical piece of metal is that you really only displace the edges of the material and the repair fails to have much longevity to it.

SKB,

You'd be correct. I put a piece of painter's tape on the back edge of the forend lug. I'm a bit sheepish right now as the thing tightened right up. No peening needed. So Mr. Rowe's method should do it when I get to it. You ever over think a simple task? Mea Culpa!

Thanks for the lesson!

Chief

I am glad you have a clearer picture of your gun's situation.

I need to start a thread on "Pets and Pests".
In furniture and cabinet work, we put minimum effort into the surfaces that only "Pets and Pests" will ever see. That is in keeping with a little peening or filing here and there for better fit.

For fun, I would coat the knuckle with green sharpie, and work the gun open and closed a bunch of times. You might be surprised how little bearing is actually used. It wipes off with most cleaners.

I think we sometimes don�t look at the full picture when it comes to gunsmiths and repairs and as an example Jack Rowe. Now for better or worse we are all products of our time, and jack is no exception. Now I have no idea how old he is but I am sure I am not that many years behind him and his training as well as my own I am sure was based on the fact that a repair was undertaken with as few replacement parts as possible and costs kept to a minimum and we don't change much during our working career. I say this because he was working and earning a living at a time here in Brit land when a lot of things where not available due to a couple of falling outs with our German cousins. So I would place an odds on bet that Jack Rowe knows the true meaning of that Brit saying �make do and mend� and another �necessity is the mother of invention.� To add another dimension to things the majority of gun ownership up to the 1950s here in Brit land was mostly people in rural areas, and a gun was a tool used to put food on the table and if it became faulty it was not taken to some high priced city gunsmith it was the local blacksmith or agricultural engineer or a man in the next village who can do repairs, and I am sure the gun was left with these parting words �repair it as cheap as possible.�
Now I have watched Jack Rowe�s u-tube offerings and I must admit to my eyes it is sound honest working gun repairs of what you see is what you get. I just thought I would mention that light hammer of his is a Brit Warrington pattern more at home in a carpenters workshop and his hack saw is one of the best designs you can have if you can find a good makers version, because it is the one good design that the handle stays in the same place no matter what orientation the blade is at.
And just as a pure mental exercise between myself and my shooting friends, if we were marooned on an island for a start the smart English guns like the Hollands and Purdies could go down with the ship we would make great efforts to rescue the Russian Baikal�s because they will work with a bucket full of sand in the action and very little servicing a real reality check! And of course Jack Rowe to keep all the guns working with experience and next to nothing in the way of spare parts.
And just to add a personal thought here when Jack leaves this world he will take more information about the how to and why about gun repairing than you will find in a stack of modern glossy how to be a gun smith books. And I do hope I am on the next bench to his in that big workshop in the sky when my turn comes hopefully tucked in between I.K. Brunel and Robert Stephenson.

So true Damascus, so true.
We forget (never having had a war on our soil in many years) what real shortage and hardship is. And how it molds us.
I collect old tools that I can see I might have use for, because I hope that the ideas and skills of previous owners will come to me when I use them. Might be superstition, might be Karma, might be guardian angels, who knows. But when I pick up a well worn file, or sharpen an old chisel or plane, I feel closer to my predecessors. And I always hope to do as well as my teachers.

I am reminded of an old television show called "Northern Exposure", a dramady based in Cicely, Alaska. Wherein the local astronaut bought a Swiss clock about 300 years old. It traveled with a clocksmith. He complained that the clock would not keep time as well as his $5.00 Seiko, that it must be faulty or defective. But, the young clockmaker said No, it's exactly as it's supposed to be, doing as it's supposed to do. Reminding him that 300 years ago 5 seconds a day was beyond any measure of performance for the time.
Jack's hands know their way around the bench.

Ever notice people don't "bronze" anymore? I learned it as "Brazing" from my father. Then an Italian guy I worked on cars with taught me a little more, and he called it "bronzing". Now it's a thing done in a salon.
Yet I open many old guns, and parts are very clearly bronzed together.

Damascus has put into words my own thoughts about the likes of Mr Rowe . I also have a thing about books most written by enthusiastic amateurs or people who have never worked on a bench and have merely picked those that have brains .
As with most things there are two ways of doing it ,the correct way that takes time and costs money and the "normal" way ,the long accepted practice . Modern welding techniques have put many of these out of date . But on this site and others I still see folk recommending gluing bits of beer can in a hook to "put a gun back on face " .Now that in my jaded eyes is a bodge job .

I agree...a piece of feeler gauge soldered in place is much better and will last a lot longer.....