doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Digweed Attacked

Nialmac, if George had a loaded firearm in his house that night and the police got wind of it, he'd be the one in trouble.

Same here Ted:
Let's be thankful that we as citizens of the United States still retain our Constitutional right to protect ourselves and the nightmare attempt over the past 7 years to remove this right will end this year.

Ya think??

It will never end! We must keep a constant vigil.

Don't worry, we still have the Constitutional Right to protect ourselves here in the U.K. too. Its written in our Bill of Rights of 1689. Lagopus.....

I feel that I should explain some things about the British and our system of government.
Firstly the British Government has since the Russian revolution when Tsar Nicholas and his family had their lives cut short by the people, the British government have done their level best to remove firearms from us the hands of general mister and misses Britain so that type of thing can�t happen here they think may be time will tell.
Unlike you lucky lot who have a constitution and a bill of rights we the unwashed folks of Britain are allowed to go about our daily lives �BY CONCENT� we do not have a right to free speech it is �BY CONCENT� this consent is given by the way of the government which Politics pays a large part for good or ill. Infact it can be withdrawn or changed at any time the government may see fit, hence the stupidity in some of the laws ascertaining to age and guns quoted by Lagopus
Now our Police from the days of the first police force here it was decided we the British people allow ourselves to be policed by �OUR CONCENT� policing is by many constabularies who in a way answer to the Government and of course the politicians can�t help trying to meddle in their workings.
Not all that clever when you look in but it works for us and we still have just an un armed bobby that we can walk up to and talk to without them looking you up and down with a hand on a pistol. Though unfortunately they now have stab vests and other things for their own protection. But I am old enough to remember the British bobby with the only protection they had was a wooden truncheon and a row of silver buttons on their jackets. They handed out corporal punishment to us young lads if they found us up to no good by giving us �a good clip around the ear� (smack across the head) it worked well but that is now nostalgia.

I was one of those for over 30 years and I can say quite certainly that we did not work for the Government. Our allegiance is to The Crown,, that is the people. The Government also work for the people with allegiance to the Crown. The Government make the legislation but do not dictate to the Police. Tony Blair did try to take control when he was in office but he would have failed. If Blair had told me to jump he would have been told go and B... well jump himself! Same for any politician. As far as I'm concerned they work for me; not the other way around. Lagopus.....

lagopus, I admire your sturdy independence. I just wish it was more evident in the general population. In 1959 I went into Thomas Bland just off The Strand and bought a shotgun, no questions asked. I was nineteen. I didn't immediately bob the barrel and start robbing banks and I suspect that today most nineteen year olds wouldn't do that either. But something has changed. Not just in Britain but most of the Western world too. A new mindset. People presume criminal intent where none is present. For many years my work took me to the worst neighborhoods of Philadelphia. I always went armed and always expected the worst from the people who lived there. But in truth it was a tiny proportion of the population who were the bad actors. Most of the drug dealers weren't violent. They were just trying to make a living. Nevertheless, most of the cops who worked those streets had a terrible opinion of their fellow men. Dealing with assholes every day for a few years will have that effect. I think TV and the constant barrage of crime stories has had the same effect on John Q. Public. Political hacks respond with "legislative solutions". People are no worse nor better now than they've ever been. It's just that the new civic religion has new rules.

No disrespect but why did so many UK people emigrate to Canada to the 'new free world' in the late 1800's and early 1900's? I guess because in the Victorian ages it was quite suppressed and they had quite a disrespect for allegiance to the Crown. And from what I am hearing from our UK board members it hasn't gotten much better. Sorry my friends, as i have many endured friends in the UK, it sounds it is not getting better.

Digweed, from my Canadian perspective I am saddened by the inability to 'legally fight back'. Your laws are much like ours. (We copied yours the for the most part).
With my bit of understanding of the law, in your's or my shoes, I probably would have sat dumfounded on what I could do to retaliate the situation without being on the wrong side of the law!

A saddened time we live in.

If George had a gun to hand his excuse would have to be that he was cleaning it or practicing mounting it or some such; from the report it sounds like the criminals were watching him through the windows; you would have thought they would wait till the gun was away. As much as everyone seems to imagine themselves as some kind of james bond with a gun behind every picture frame, the reality is when three guys jump through your french windows while you are eating your dinner on the sofa they have the upper hand as they have you completely off guard they probably beat him before he was even aware of what happened.

In two relatively recent cases criminals have been shot at in the UK by legal gun owners and the judge has ruled in the favor of the victim ( this is not always the case )

In one case i recall a burglar was shot with a shotgun and the judge commented that if you break into a gun owners house; expect to get shot ( not word for word quote but it was something like ) http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/c...-break-ins.html

This farmer got around the storage issue by not legally owning the gun - court rules in his favor.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-127513/Farmer-shot-intruder-walks-free.html

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/derbyshire/3954033.stm



In another case a man was threatening to break in to someones house where a man, woman and young child were, the man shot the intruder with an air rifle - judge commented that the man genuinely feared for the safety of his wife and child and was acting for their protection. http://metro.co.uk/2011/02/17/man-praised-by-judge-for-firing-air-rifle-at-burglar-639667/

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-...amily-home.html

So its not like we would be instantly banged up *IF a firearm was used for self defense it depends on how a court interprets the situation, and in the cold light of day that may be very different to how you thought in the heat of the moment. The problem with firearms for self defense in this country have several problems.

We have to keep them locked in a cabinet - So nine times out of ten they are not going to be to hand.

The heat of the moment, you might make rash decisions with serious consequences; In the US you might think if someone breaks in they deserve to be shot; in the UK we would have to prove that our actions were "proportionate".

Gun owners culturally do not think of their guns as for self defense; they think of them as sporting equipment.