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"Have a drink..."

About time someone said something intelligent.


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When I'm lost in the urban jungle I usually end up at Lafayette Coney Island. You might have to step over a couple bums and knock out an overly aggressive panhandler, but it beats the heck out of sitting under a bush in the snow waiting to garrote a bird.

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Honestly, I was looking at that suit! Yep, that's Trudeau. He'll make lots of mistakes---if this was one, you never know in this age of stagecraft---but there are signs that he is his own man.

He's not soft under the suit, either. Very fit. Spotted a native Conservative senator 30 pounds in a boxing match, no one gave him a chance, and gave him a real trimming. Man to watch even as a Liberal.

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keith Offline OP
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It is eye opening, yet not at all surprising to see several guys finding excuses to either support the most dedicated and extreme anti-gun candidate, Hillary Clinton, or to just stay home on election day... which has the same effect.

It all proves what I've been saying all along, and that is that support for our gun rights is not as widespread and strong as some here would like to believe. THAT is the reason we have been in a never ending battle to maintain our gun rights. If the 40 million gun owners in this country ever voted in unison, that would be a voting bloc that would stifle the threat permanently and immediately. Only one in eight gun owners cares enough to join what Bill Clinton called the most effective lobby in Washington... the NRA. Imagine the clout if we could just double that number to one in four. But anti-gun politicians can always count on support from people who consider themselves pro-gun, but actually undermine the 2nd Amendment.

Yes, there is always more to an election than guns. Failure to understand and respect the clear meaning and original intent of the 2nd Amendment has always suggested to me a likely inability to understand or respect the rest of the Bill of Rights. But some guys repeat the anti-gun idea that the individual right to keep and bear arms is a recent thing, not recognized by the framers, and only first recognized by Atty. Gen John Ashcroft in 2002. Even when corrected and shown proof, they persist... yet claim there is not an anti-gunner on this board!

Originally Posted By: King Brown
Ed, historically the individual "right" to bear arms is relatively new. I believe John Ashcroft in 2002 became the first federal attorney-general to proclaim that individuals should be able to own guns. The Supreme Court in 2008 overturned all mainstream legal and historical scholarship by ruling that there is an individual right to own firearms although with some limits. Obama said it again last week.

I believe that during the previous 218 years the Second meant what it said: firearms shall be held by "the People"---a collective and not individual right---insofar they are in the service of "a well-regulated militia." Was an individual right even mentioned at the Constitutional Convention or in the House when it ratified the Amendment or when debated in state legislatures? I don't think so.


"To disarm the people...is the most effectual way to enslave them."
- George Mason, referencing advice given to the British Parliament by Pennsylvania governor Sir William Keith, The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution, June 14, 1788






A true sign of mental illness is any gun owner who would vote for an Anti-Gunner like Joe Biden.

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"To disarm the people...is the most effectual way to enslave them."
- George Mason, referencing advice given to the British Parliament by Pennsylvania governor Sir William Keith, The Debates in the Several State Conventions on the Adoption of the Federal Constitution, June 14, 1788




[/quote]

The most powerful & effective lobby is AIPAC. In country with very powerful military and police people do not have to be disarmed to be enslaved. Bunch of citizens with semi-auto firearms have no chance against the Government with powerful military force. Opposition would just result in massive casualties.

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Although Obama is doing his best to change us....

The difference in our country and others is that for the most part the United States is made up of sane people that are not controlled by some idiocy/lunatic hiding behind of the name of religion.

Only a radical would think we need weapons to protect us from our police or military most are our sons and daughters....one day we may need weapons to protect us from a foreign invader/Nato/Obama Trojan horse.


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Originally Posted By: HomelessjOe
Although Obama is doing his best to change us....

The difference in our country and others is that for the most part the United States is made of of sane people that are not controlled by some idiocy/lunatic hiding behind of the name of religion.

Only a radical would think we need weapons to protect us from our police or military most are our sons and daughters....one day we may need weapons to protect us from a foreign invader/Nato/Obama Trojan horse.



What would have happened on May 4th 1970 at Kent State if the protesters had firearms and shot back?


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There would've been a lot more dead protestors.

I'm a firm believer that once protestors attack police/people or destroy property that deadly force should be used.

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Originally Posted By: Gunflint Charlie
Originally Posted By: canvasback
A very good case could be made that Obama is temperamentally unable to execute properly the office of President. Over 7 1/2 years he has shown a level of laziness in office rarely seen before as well as a complete inability for forge a working relationship with anyone but those in lockstep with his agenda.

Bill Clinton, it could be argued, had a fatal flaw in his focus on dalliances with whatever woman crossed his path, as well as a remarkable fluidity with truth, even for a politician. His ill-advised policies regarding banking and mortgages led directly to the world wide financial melt down of 2007/2008.

All Presidents are unknown quantities until they step into the Oval Office. There is no previous job experience that tells us for sure how they will behave, how well they do. It is hard to imagine electing a President with a thinner job resume, and less public knowledge about who he was and how he would behave than Obama. Yet America did it. And I'm hard pressed to imagine how Trump could be worse.


So it comes to this? Trump is good enough because he's no less qualified than Obama?? Could the bar be any lower? I can no more vote for Trump than I could have voted Obama.

As for the temperaments of other presidents, Trump's issues are in a whole other category. IMO, a man of such deep narcissism and hair-trigger judgment, whose incapacitated brain helplessly obsesses over trivial personal offense, is a dangerous risk as Commander-in-Chief in ways that make other presidents' temperament issues seem inconsequential.

I can't agree that all presidents are unknown quantities until they take office -- there's plenty known of them. Of course we can't know for sure what they'll do beforehand, but that's hardly an argument for ignoring red flags in what we do know of a candidate.

Jay


Obviously this is just opinion and speculation but here goes. I think Trump is purposefully being thin skinned and outrageous. I don't think you get to run the businesses he has, employ the quality people he has over the long run if you don't have some skills.

He's not a buffoon. He just plays one on tv. Why? Because it allows him, in the primaries (or back as a tv personality) to say things that separate him from the pack. To stand out. He's just finished a bar room brawl with a dozen other candidates. You don't play fair and you fight to win. And his tactics, playing to the crowd he needed to play to, took him from a fringe candidate given zero chance, to winning the prize.

With each passing electoral cycle, the game changes. The US that elected Truman, Kennedy, Reagan or Clinton no longer exists. Media behave differently. Voters get exposed to different things.....different aspects of each candidate. Trump is IMHO playing the game almost perfectly for the US that exists in 2016.

As for comments like King's, suggesting Trump is a facist, well that is simply the bitter handwringing of people worried they will be on the losing side. Trump is a populist, not a facist and not a true Republican. No matter. He is who is getting elected next November.

Remember, without the Superdelegates, who owe allegiance to Bill, where would Hill be against Bernie. Maybe losing, certainly neck and neck. Hillary is so bad that she can barely beat an independent unrepentant socialist.

Last fall, no one paid attention to Trump's candidacy.
In January he was a joke whose run would end soon.
In February, no candidate could say what Trump says and win the primaries.
In March, the forces to stop Trump started to gather.
In April, his opponenents fell by the wayside.
In May, his polling numbers are starting to be competitive with Hillary's, good and bad.

Trump has been ridiculed, rebuked and dismissed. And he keeps coming. He keeps getting better results.

If you want a continuation of the status quo, unbelievably disfunctional government regardless of which party is in the Oval Office or who control Congress, vote for Hill or stay home. If you would like a chance for a difference, I'd say take off the media shaped blinders and have a really close look at Trump.

Some measure of the man can be seen in his children. Dig up some details on who these scions of unbelievable wealth are. It's hard not to be impressed when they are compared to their peers.


The world cries out for such: he is needed & needed badly- the man who can carry a message to Garcia
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Ditto to what Canvasback said.



I am glad to be here.
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Let's see. Trump makes his campaign one of appealing to voters who like thin-skinned, outrageous buffoons -- or maybe don't recognize buffoonery when it spatters in their faces.

But somehow seeing and not liking his buffoonery is a problem of wearing "media shaped blinders".

Ok then.

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