doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Bottom rib trouble

The Pieper was a "Mono-Block" gun even though Pieper did not use that term. The one I have has a steel breech piece & twist barrels. The tubes are threaded & soft soldered about half way into the breech piece. The forend lug & all ribs are soft soldered, there is no brazing on this gun anywhere.

It seems to me that if the purpose of a BT is to protect from hot barrels, then instead of being quite rare on British game guns, they'd be much more common. A very active drive is certainly one place you can heat up your barrels. As for gripping a BT tighter than a splinter, I'm sure not everyone does that. But the BT makes it easier to grip tighter than does a splinter, simply because there's more to grab onto.

I assume you don't think there is a chance that the Brits wouldn't "go for the beavertail" because they didn't invent it. Certainly, they would adopt an upstart "colonial" idea if it were a good one, wouldn't they?

Just what do you think is the purpose of a beavertail, Larry? Recoil attenuation ................ really? Or is there some esoteric purpose to which you ascribe?

SRH

Well Stan . . . the Brits certainly adopted driven shooting, didn't they? And that was invented by the French!

I think the purpose of a beavertail, as much as anything, is to sell shotguns to people who think they need something more substantial to grab onto than the barrels of a sxs. And, back in the day, quite a few American gun writers seemed to prefer BT. That also might explain why the Spanish maker Sarasqueta sent 7 different models of sxs to the American importer Stoeger back in 1961 . . . and all 7 of them are shown in the Stoeger Shooter's Bible with a beavertail. The Spanish didn't invent it either, but they understood the American market--or maybe Stoeger helped them understand it. Similarly, of the various models of sxs imported from SKB in Japan by Ithaca, only one (the 100) had a splinter. Miroku didn't make any of its Browning BSS guns for the American market with a splinter (other than the sidelock).

In short, the purpose of a beavertail is whatever the buyer thinks it is. And if he thinks he needs one, he will demonstrate that belief by buying a gun with a beavertail. If you want to know why . . . well, I guess you'd need to ask. Me, I think they're unnecessary, add weight, and just plain don't look as good. But there was very clearly a period of time, post-WWII, when the American public thought--for whatever reason, and probably not because they were worried about hot barrels (that being a fairly rare thing, especially on a hunting gun)--that beavertails belonged on sxs.

This late production 12 ga. SKB 200E started life with a beavertail. I was lucky enough to find a factory splinter forend and with the forend swap and changing the factory ventilated rubber pad to a microcell the gun's weight dropped from 6 lbs. 14 oz. to just under 6 1/2 pounds. Me likey much better!

Exactly. Which gets us right back to where we started when I said ....



Notice the IMO part of that statement? You are the one who took "what I think it is" to task. Either the purpose is what the buyer thinks it is, or it is what YOU think it is, which is "to sell shotguns to people who think they need something more substantial .........". Which is it, Larry? Maybe you should make your mind up, or stop nitpicking other's opinions.

SRH

Well Stan, you followed that with a discussion about the purpose NOT being attenuating recoil . . . which I never said it was. The reason more people are likely to apply more pressure to a BT vs a splinter seems pretty simple to me: because there's more to grab. Whether they SHOULD grab on hard is another issue. But it's quite clear that they can, and that some will.

You're ONE gun buyer and I'm ONE gun buyer. So we're clearly both entitled to opinions about the advantages we might see in a BT. But while a BT will protect your hand from hot barrels, how big of an issue is that for the majority of American sxs shooters? The sxs isn't a terribly popular target gun, other than at sxs shoots. For most owners, it's a hunting gun. And there simply aren't too many situations in which you're going to get your barrels hot enough to burn your fingers while hunting. IMO, of course.

IMHO, forend lug failure is a byproduct of the force people use to close (and open) the gun, not from shooting.

The bigger the hunk of wood, the more concentrated is the stress on the lug during ham handed operation.

Grasp mostly barrel with a splinter, less force transmitted through the lug.

Snap action guns just need to go 'click' to seat the bolt.

And why does a gun need to be held against the upper thigh, and yanked open forcibly?

People tear things up the way they use them, it's not the design or assembly most of the time causing the trouble.

Here's the difference, Larry, and is the last thing I will have to say about it. What I said was qualified as being my opinion, and in being interesting hearing what others were saying. You came back and took issue with what was my opinion. I never claimed anything that I said was inerrant. But, as you so often do, you have to have the last say and try to point out the error in others' opinions.

But, I am so unimpressed with your "knowledge", professor, that I am going to cut the rest of your class............and go let my ugly BSS beavertail keep my dainty little fingers off the hot barrels, like IMO it was intended to do.

Preach on.

SRH

Well Stan, I'm glad to hear your dainty little fingers are safe and sound, thanks to that beavertail. But then you could always buy yourself a glove, which would not only protect your dainty digits from hot barrels, but would also protect the barrels from frequent contact with a sweaty hand if you happen to be shooting a gun with a splinter.