doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Meriden Firearms

Great pic Doug and I'm going to add the 'Meriden Special' shot to the 'Case Colors' PictureTrail. Thanks! Drew

Drew-

Thank you for the kind words and I would consider it an honor!

Here is another photo, showing original case color (we know it has to be original because who in their right mind would bother to re-color a Meriden), on high spots where case color isn't often seen on guns this old.

Would you mind providing the link to the case color picture trail...I don't think I have seen that one (your research and photographic documentation in creating the damascus picture trail, has been literally "trail blazing!").

Doug

I had a Meriden 12 bore hammer gun with fluid barrels and sidelocks that wre owered by coil springs. It was a nice old gun with quite good workmanship and I'm sorry I sold it about 15 years ago. Chops

Doug, excellent info - thanks. I will check it out further tomorrow. For what the guy is asking I don't think I can turn down my first hammer gun. This one looks basically the same as yours but it has a different stamp on the side, it says " Meriden Firearms"

I have a Meriden Arms Co pump shotgun. 12ga hammerless takedown. Top tang safety. Serial number 6xx. 30" plain Bbl, Full choke. Extra BBl assembly #'d 5xx. Rounded pistol grip stock with small side panels. The only markings on the gun are on the top of the barrel is -Fluid Steel Krupp Essen-. On the op-rod is 'Meriden Fire Arms Co. Meriden Conn. USA / Savage Patents Granted, Mar. 5, 1912'. Unfortunetly the stock is missing the butt plate and is cracked and missing a piece of wood at the head. The metal, at least the barrels, have been reblued. It does still shoot nicely though! Anyone have any info on a Meriden Arms Co pump shotgun?? I thought the KRUPP-ESSEN marking was interesting..

Another great pic Doug, and I'll add that one to the 'Case Colors' album also.
You can now access ALL TWENTY FOUR ALBUMS (I seriously need to get a life!) here http://www.picturetrail.com/revdocdrew

If any one has a Meriden or Audbrey with a maker's mark on the barrel tubes or barrel flats, please post the information. If you have a picture of the maker's mark that would be great.

Sears talks about their relationship with makers in Liege in their catalogs. However, they never indicate who that maker might be. I have been able to identify one maker, but I am sure there were more.

Pete

CParker-

You are very welcome and I hope things go well for you today. I have no idea of why these two guns are marked differently or why the Meriden Firearms Company marketed two lines of what appear to be the same shotguns (A. J. Aubrey and Meriden). Perhaps the "Special" was used to reflect an upgraded shotgun (damascus barrels)? The patent date on the rib is 1907, and others on this forum have reported seeing the Meriden in later Sears catalogues (my 1908 reprint lists only A.J. Aubrey guns).

My first gun of any kind, given to my by my father was when I was 11, was a Savage Stevens box lock SxS .410 and all other doubles since were box locks. I had never fired a hammer gun until I purchased the Meriden earlier this year. While the hammer gun will never replace my box locks in the field, I must confess I was surprised to find how readily I came to appreciate some of the hammer gun's features. Here is my list of discoveries about the hammer gun (so far):

1. No need for snap caps.
2. The action naturally falls open when the lever is operated for easy reloading.
3. When shooting trap the shooter needs only to cock the barrel to be fired.
4. The gun is very safe when loaded and not cocked and one can tell at a glance (or touch) if it is ready to fire.
5. User friendly to inspect, clean and service. With the removal of a single screw the locks come out.

If you end up bringing the Meriden home with you today, you will also find that you cannot get the hammer to fall against the firing pin unless the trigger is pulled- so this is a safe action as well.

One thing, which may be peculiar to my shotgun, however, did surface and that is I cannot open the action with the right hammer cocked as the top lever is stopped just short of full travel by the hammer. In the field the hammer gun can be more of a challenge and slower to bring into action because of the need to cock the hammers before firing. Leaving the shotgun open and cocked can speed things up a bit but the shotgun is not as comfortable to carry and while closing the shotgun is a lot faster than cocking both hammers, it is much slower than releasing a safety. Everyone who I have allowed to shoot my Meriden invariably forgets to cock the hammer(s) back at least once and I'll confess, I have done it several time; new habits are hard to learn. Also, the hammer screws on my shotgun tended to shoot loose until I put some thread lock on them.

What I find interesting, however, is how long the hammer gun survived in the presence of the hammerless guns. I have read that early in the development of the hammerless systems, the hammer gun was thought to offer a more robust action that was less prone to parts breakage. While a dollar was worth quite a bit more when these Meridens were sold, that extra dollar could have bought the customer a more modern action. Yet in the case of my shotgun (and apparently many others), many felt the money was better spent by upgrading to damascus barrels than to have the hammerless shotgun.

In sum, because of the hammers and weight, my Meriden hammer gun will likely never replace my light (6 3/4 pound) and quick handling 12ga Fox for bird shooting and because of the tight chokes and greater weight, the Meriden will never replace my other shotguns when shooting skeet. For trap shooting, however, the Meriden is a fine performer and it would likely do a very good job on waterfowl.

If the gun checks out and follows you home, you will likely find that your Meriden hammer gun will get a lot of attention from your fellow shooters because outside of special shoots, you just don't see a whole lot of folks using hammer guns these days and many will marvel at how well the old gun performs. Bring along extra ammunition as your fellow shooters are surprisingly alike in their appreciation for the history that these old shotgun evoke and they will be quick to take you up on any offer to give the shotgun a try.

Doug

Drew-

Thanks so much and do please keep up the great work you are doing!

Doug




Pete-

I share your curiosity on this point. Apparently, if the barrels were maker marked (at least on my shotgun), those marks were removed by the Meriden company when the gun was made. I looked the barrels over very carefully and could find no makers markings whatsoever.

My 1908 reprint of the Sears catalogue reflects that there may have been several different types of Liege (sometimes referred to as “improved Liege”) made damascus barrels used on these guns. Twist damascus barrels are described as simply “twist” in the standard guns, and in other cases they are described as “two blade Liege twist” and “triple-leaf twist” (in the A.J. Aubrey Specials). No matter how the twist barrels were described, they appear to cost the customer $1.00 more. So perhaps in answer to my earlier question regarding the meaning of the “Special” designation of my Meriden, that designation may be an indication that the barrels on the shotgun are either two blade twist or triple-leaf twist (however, I would note that those A.J. Aubrey guns marketed as “Special” have engraving that my Meriden lacks).

The highest grade damascus available was referred to as two-blade (also called double blade), and three-blade. Across the line adding two or three-blade to the shotgun, cost $4.00 more than the fluid steel ($3 over the twist). The three-blade shotguns were hammerless and richly embellished with engraving and depending on the level of embellishment cost between $30.75 and $38.50. In that same catalogue, an L.C. Smith 2- blade damascus shotgun with modest embellishment sold for $42 and the highest grade LC Smith sold by Sears with 3-blade damascus sold for $56.

Knowing from Kutter, that his Meriden pump shotgun has a Krupp steel barrel, may be an indication that the Meriden Firearms company was not out to cut costs in the barrel steels selected from their overseas suppliers, but was looking for the highest value in steel. It would therefore not surprise me to learn that the Meriden damascus shotguns were using the same Belgian damascus barrels as supplied to best American manufacturers of the day.

It would be interesting to see if the Sears corporation still has the records of their brief foray into the world of firearms manufacturing to get a better sense of the production numbers, suppliers of the materials and what actually caused Sears to close the company. While it is easy to see how WW 1 could have curtailed the demand for sporting arms, a number of sporting firearms companies (if not most) managed to survive and those other companies did not have the financial backing of a huge retailer like Sears. If left to speculate, I would be inclined to believe that A.J. Aubrey’s vision of delivering a product equal to the best American made products but at a price that was competitive with the cheaper imports, proved to be more difficult in practice than in theory and the venture did not deliver the promised margin of profit (either due to lack of volume, or due to the actual costs associated with production of a quality product).

Doug

are there any parts available for this gun i have a 12ga. and need some pieces MC