doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Manufrance Self Opener 16

I was watching a MF on Proxibid a week or two ago. A decent 16ga with buyers premium was still under 1K. I think the model was 2R? Anyway a nice gun for the price, too bad I missed the auction.

I have one in 28ga.

the self-opening function is real and can be traced to the ejectors, an unusual option.
They push against the breech face, thereby providing the opening function...
I am not sure if this was a feature or a by-product.
Anyways, not a bad gun, but not cheap indeed.
Note the lack of St-etienne proofs. It seems like la manu was at some point authorized to do their own proofing.
All the best,
WC-

Nothing close to being a �self opener�. Assisted opening, maybe. Like WC mentioned, the system works in similar fashion as C&H Avant Tout, Mod. 21, etc. it provides some help in opening, but not much, and only under certain circumstances.

Wood wear doesn't seem to match the finishes showing on the metal.

I have a Model 244 ManuFrance with the same, self-opener spring.

Mine is a standard A&D style 16 BLE. I was told that Model 244 was made from 1932 to 1939. Leftover stock was sold until 1948 following the war.
The gun will self-open fired or unfired even when inverted. The self-opener springs are always active. They are not connected to the ejectors in any way.

I have always believed the adage that:
The French copy no one, and no one copies the French. (Think Citron CV2)

This mechanism fits the adage. I have never seen it copied or used by anyone else. It is really a cool mechanism.

It appears the self-opening springs could be removed if the feature is not needed.


Joe

One thing about these guns, it seems no matter how much you try to learn or think you know there's always something new. My Ideal has ejectors but I hadn't noticed their role in assisting opening. They sure don't make working the cocking/release lever any easier, but yes, once you cock it, the gun seems to open almost by itself. I assumed it was similar to mechanisms like the "inert" Jones underlever in hammerguns where once released gravity alone can more or less open the gun. Will have to try it inverted and see if there's any movement. I'll be impressed and a bit surprised if the ejector springs make much impression on the barrels when gravity is telling them to stay closed.

As I see it any gun which pushes the ejectors in on closing by the breech face could likewise be termed as an assisted opener. Nothing at all rare about that as this is I believe the most common method of cocking ejectors. This could thus be called rare only if the particular model of gun was rarely fitted with ejectors.

As the vast majority of the US built Lefever Arms Co guns used inframe ejectors which do not push the ejectors in by the breech with only a few of the early guns have forend ejectors then this could be considered rare on them.

Further to Miller's post, ejectors on MF Ideals are quite rare. As WC said, an unusual option.

Hey Joe, re " no one copies the French. (Think Citron CV2)," I think Casimir Lefaucheux might disagree...Lang engaged in the most amazingly brazen infringement of a patent, the center break long-gun, after seeing one at the 1851 Crystal Palace fair, that one can imagine....and we are all still copying and benefiting.:)

Re the self opening thing. having handled a few dozen Ideals, I have yet to see two identical guns. However, all the Robust Ideals inspected had lively self opening actions. How lively? As lively than the Holland action.

A few I saw had ball fences, which are for some way more appealing than the straight (humped?) backed Webley type of fence.