doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Shotshell "Spreaders" & "Concentrators"

Unfortunately I do not have Early Shotgun Concentrators and Spreaders: The First One Hundred Years of Invention to Control the Flight of Shot published by Gary Muckel in 2009

I came across this notice in the December 5, 1896 Sporting Life ; "rotary shot spreader"
https://digital.la84.org/digital/collection/p17103coll17/id/46545/rec/1



Jan. 5, 1901



In 1902 Brown offered an improved spreader device "The Hummer"



Sept. 13, 1902



Sept. 10, 1904



U.M.C. introduced their "Short Range Shells" in fall, 1904
https://books.google.com/books?id=n-gcAQAAMAAJ&pg=RA6-PA57&lpg

Sept. 24, 1904 "powder gas is introduced into the shot charge"? no wad? hole in the wad?



Dec. 31 1904

Peters was late to the party with "Spreader Loads"
"tested in the field for two seasons" but I did not find any ads prior to 1907, nor did I find a description of an insert

Nov. 9, 1907 Sporting Life



Nov. 21, 1908

Thanks Drew,

Ecclesiastes 1:9, ...there is no new thing under the sun.

John

Greener's The Gun, 1907 Edition
Winans's Shot Spreader
https://books.google.com/books?id=3HMCAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA587&vq

Ah, now I know why RST brands their 28ga spreader loads as �Brush�. A nice nod to shotshell history.

Drew.

Did I see a box of 23 regular and 2 spreader shells packaged for skeet shooters ? If I remember correctly they were on a table at a gun show

Boats

I have not seen shells packaged that way but it sounds like a good idea...Geo

Bro. Boats is correct. This Remington (low resolution) ad was from 1929, and the box had "scatter loads" for incoming doubles and station 8.

For several years Remington Arms Co., Inc.'s NITRO CLUB Skeet Loads had nineteen regular shells and six spreaders while their cheaper ShurShot Skeet Loads were just twenty-five regular shells.

Early Shotgun Concentrators and Spreaders by Gary B. Muckel, 195 pages, $55 plus $3 shipping in USA. Order from:

Gary B. Muckel
6531 Carlsbad Dr.
Lincoln, NE 68510

In the Sept. 1928 issue of "Hunting and Fishing" there is an article by W.H. Foster "An Analysis of Shotgun Performance in Skeet" and a Remington "New Remington Skeet Loads" ad.
Unfortunately, there is no description of what makes the "Scatterloads" scatter, and in 12g both loads are #8s, 3 Dr. Eq. 1 1/8 oz.

Remington-U.M.C. "Scatter Load" boxes

Winchester promoted the "Brush" gun concept very early - October 1897



July 1898



and used the same illustration in December 1904 to introduce "Brush" shells





1905

Posted by Gary Muckle
https://forum.cartridgecollectors.org/t/an-interesting-peters-shotshell/7334/3
There is also an image of a sectioned Peters "Spreader" shell



"Christie Method of Loading Short Range Shot Shells"
UMC Company's new short range entry on the market in 1907 was titled "UMC SCATTER LOAD" and was followed by "SHORT RANGE" using the Christie design. The Christie design creates layers of shot separated by card wads. It was a simple adaptation of available materials and popular and effective and still used by hand loaders today. Lewis D. Christie of Bridgeport, Conn. is credited with the design which was used by UMC beginning about 1907 as a short range load. Western Cartridge Company later used this technique calling them "Thicket" loads.

Christie, as assignor to Union Metallic Cartridge Co., received patent No. 873.346 on December 10, 1907 for "A scatter load for shot cartridges comprising a shot charge divided into a plurality of sections separated by wads, top and bottom wads and a covering of light paper enclosing the charge and secured in place independently of the cartridge shell."
This technique reportedly solved the problem of slow loading each shot compartment of wad and shot. This patent of December 10, 1907 was adopted by UMC.

Western Cartridge Co.'s FIELD "Thicket" Load from 1922 Catalog --



Xpert "Thicket" Load 1937 --



Xpert "Brush" Load 1951 --

Remington Arms Co., Inc. NITRO CLUB "Scatter" Load 1923 Catalogue No. 107 --

FN-Browning introduced their dice shotshells in the 1980's or so:

https://books.google.fi/books?id=6TGCBAA...dge&f=false

Markus

1910



1911



1913 20g shells for introduction of the 20g M12

Drew, Researcher, others - thanks for sharing as I really enjoy this kind of stuff.

Doc you an Internet googling fool.

If you spent as much time saving souls as you do googling on the internet the world would be a better place.

Ditto.

Thanks to Drew and Dave for their tireless efforts of imparting their wisdom to the rest of us. You gents make learning fun!!

Fascinating stuff.

Spreader and concentrator loads are about as old as choke boring. When considering such loads it is worthwhile to think on how patterns work. Each piece of shot follows a ballistic path based on the velocity and actual direction it is pointed at the point it is last influenced by other pieces of shot. We can consider that each piece of shot has a forward (direction the gun is pointed) velocity and a sideways velocity (90 degrees to the forward direction). The forward velocity is large and the sideways is small. Choke effect seems to be constrained to cylinder bore to full bore. To get more or less choke effect we must introduce something else into the shot load. Spreaders have been more effective than have been concentrators.

There are two more or less fundamental ways to spread the pattern. We have to have some way to inpart additional sideways velocity. Over shot wads have been maligned for "breaking up the pattern." Bingo! We add several over shot wads. However, the wads act outside the barrel and, thus, have a significant degree of randomness to the disruption they cause. The other way is to add a "post" within the shot column. the shot will pressurize the post during acceleration. As the shot clears the muzzle the post will depressurize and, thus, give back a degree of energy to the shot in the sideways direction. The shot will have an additional amount of sideways velocity. The post is much more controlled and much less random in how many and how much individual pellets are influenced.

DDA

I have some RST spreader loads I used in a tightly choked 12GA. They worked well on pheasant. I believe that RST uses crossed cards inside the shot column. I didn't see that method discussed above. Is that a new approach or what? It has to be simpler than some of the ones mentioned above. I can't imagine inserting the cards can be accomplished any way except by hand, but then I've never seen commercial loaders in operation.

I buy Fiocchi Interceptors two flats at the time, several orders a year, for use in my fixed choke (.020" and .020") MX8. It is shot exclusively at sporting clays, and my home course has a tendency to throw some very close stuff at speed. Those are not, IMO, good presentations, as they are so close that in a hunting situation I'd never take the shot at the bird. But, for the sake of the scorecard I want to ensure a dead bird if possible.

These loads have an X post in the middle of the wad, and work very well. They're the only spreaders I've ever used that I know open my pattern consistently more than one "constriction". IOW, my modified fixed chokes go to a little more open than a IC. I've used my own concoctions and off the shelf spreaders, but I like these the best. They're sky blue in color, and I jokingly call them my "Crystal Blue Persuasion".

Im ordering two more flats as I post this.

https://www.hinterlandoutfitters.com/adv...n_description=0

SRH

This method is described in W W Greener's 1907 "The Gun" which Drew linked above. Greener stated it was Winans' invention, so no it's not new at all.

Polywad Spred-R post & disc insert
https://polywad.com/spred-r-1

All the Spred-Rs are out of stock at Precision Reloading

A number of years ago I hunted preserve pheasant with a Model 21 choked M/F. I used the Polywad spreader loads, because ranges were fairly short. I found that they hammered pheasants - every bird I hit was dead right there. I sold the gun to fund another purchase and still have a handful of the shells. Since I now hunt with older British sxs, I don't use them. But I still recall my amazement at how well they worked.

The card X-wads will absorb some/a little energy and return it to the pellets upon muzzle exit giving them a bit more sideways velocity. The over shot wads will act as disrupters to the shot cloud.

A resilient post wad will work better, including the lowly golf tee. Note also, that spreader loads should normally be loaded with the smallest shot needed for the intended target; #9 for clays but bigger for phez.

DDA

February 24, 1912 Sporting Life and Parker is "the finest brush gun made"



Baker Batavia Brush 1906- c.1914
https://books.google.com/books?id=fYsoAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA87

Most of the images are gone, but this is a good thread and I'll work on recovering them.

This is interesting. A 1975 patent for a shot dispersion control device
https://patents.google.com/patent/US4006688
"Robert S. Elliott, in his U.S. Pat. No. 579,429 (1897), described a shot-distributing wad in an effort to enlarge the pattern of shot formed and to make the shot pattern more regular and evenly distributed."

https://www.trapshooters.com/threads/elliott-brothers-shooting-park-opens.337233/

https://books.google.com/books?id=phF9AAAAMAAJ&pg=PA1837&lpg

Peters Victor Spreader Load



which were still offered in the 50s

Western Field Thicket Load (see Researcher's post on p. 2)



Ranger Brush

Spreader loads have been discussed for years on this forum. Many, especially hunters criticize them as a danger to the dogs in upland hunting situations. I've used RST Spread-Rs and Polywad doublewides enough to have some opinions.

They're useless past twenty yards because they spread too much to effectively kill anything and become a real danger to the bird dogs. Within twenty yards though they'll make a better shot of you as well as convert your tight choked guns into bird killers, and any bird dog shot with them is the hunter's fault for shooting too close to the dog or the dog jumping into the line of fire.

Good information on the history of these interesting alternative shotgun loads in this thread...Geo

I killed two doves with one shot with Fiocchi Interceptors and my HE Fox, two seasons ago. Both were dishrag dead before hitting the ground. They were at about 25 yards, crossing, when shot. The maximum distance at which spreaders are useful depends on several factors, IMO, one of which is how much choke constriction the barrel has to begin with.

I'm a huge fan of the Fiocchis for close rabbit targets and really close crossers on a sporting clays course.

Capt. Charles Askins and E.M. Sweeley “Ballistics of the Shotgun” series; Outdoor Life March 1923 “Shot Spreaders”
https://archive.org/details/sim_outdoor-life_1923-03_51_3/page/198/mode/2up

I have 2 old old box of federal 16ga spreaders never tried them.

I have posted about this before, but will add it here for the benefit of anyone looking to develop a spreader load. I had a Beretta 425 12 gauge that I wanted to use for doves. It was choked F/M and the tight barrel would completely destroy a dove at 25 yards. Since I like to eat them, I had to figure out a spreader load if I wanted to use the gun.

I tried several types, but the polywad post style seemed to work best when patterning. It did have something of a hole in the center of the pattern, but I heard about a guy who solved that problem by putting part of the shot over the post. I used the Federal plastic hulls that have a very large capacity. A one ounce charge bar was used to drop the shot, then I added the post, and then another 1/4 oz of shot over the post. That eliminated the hole and the gun shot a very consistent modified pattern in the tight barrel. The spreader had some effect on the modified barrel, but not nearly as much as the full choke barrel.

Those shells took a little extra time to load, but they made the gun useful.

Sporting Life December 1, 1886
https://digital.la84.org/digital/collection/p17103coll17/id/51527/rec/7
"...kills game at 100 to 140 yards..." !

Sorry for the necro post but I'm going back through the forum looking for Damascus case restorations. I actually have one of these sporting shrapnel shells that came to me in a gun case. I think that a person would hope to find the empty clamshell after firing one and at least some of the time recover it in order to re-use it.