doublegunshop.com - home Forums General Discussion DoubleGun BBS @ doublegunshop.com Who is in the English Trade Today?

".... and trying to pass them off as English high quality guns. Powell is one there junk ....."

I don't think this is quite fair. Powell, certainly in their former days in Birmingham, were very open that the "Heritage" series guns as they were called then were from continental makers. It is well known that today's Powells are not English, though they have dropped the "Heritage" name.

I do know that Arrieta built guns for Powell.

John

"Monkey metal?"" What exactly is the metallurgical composition in AISI numericals?? Most forged steel receivers, etc. are in the 4140 range- not certain about the "lodt wax" or "investment cast" metals Bill Ruger used. I am a welder by trade, and am always looking to learn more about metallurgy--Thanks- RWTF

RWTF, It is my experience that many actions are investment castings or even sintered. Component parts such as levers are often not heattreated / hardened as necessary. Welding repairs can often be problematical due to inclusions in the metals. I am sure metal analysis before welding would help but time is money and the 'foreigners' are not good to weld .

I have had 6 English doubles from W&C Scott, J Dickson to J Purdey self opener and 7 spanish sidelocks. Maybe I have been lucky but the internals of the spanish guns, where they might skimp, have been perfect, finished to a high degree. The only issue I have seen is fitting of the forearm wood to metal on some of the spanish guns was not perfect. Naturally the engraving on an AyA #2 doesn't compare to a Purdey. I have a pair of Arietta's made for Griffin and Howe that I would compare to anyones guns.

I see in the current edition of Covey Rise, that , is it Michael, Louca is making Watson Bros. guns in house except for the forgings and engraving. The article says they make 10-12 per year.

Yes
If you drop in you�ll see him at the bench.

I'm learning from this conversation. It strengthens my judgement and biases toward shotguns. I have one "English" gun, a good-condition 1913 A&N 12 gauge. Embellishments aside, it's more than enough for me. Handloading also puts in good use my American "classics." I think of all of them as practical bests for me, and that's all that counts, eh?

I think most guns made to sell "off the rack" are less expensive guns, made God knows where. If you go to a gunmaker of repute you can buy a gun made completely in the UK.Quality costs money and, like elsewhere, the mass produced O/U is what sells to most shooters.

I prefer to shop amongst the guns on the 'pre-owned' market and have done well buying very high quality guns for reasonable money. I have bought one or two "English" guns made with Spanish locks and with generally lower quality workmanship. These I have returned to the seller.

Rigby isn�t making the rising bite actions in house, they are made to an extremely high degree by ex-Purdey machinist now independent Ian Clarke outside of London but still in England. They only finish in house, and recently I�ve seen they are outsourcing some of that as well.